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#1 meneltour27  Icon User is offline

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c++ vs visual C++

Post icon  Posted 03 July 2009 - 05:51 AM

is there any deference between c++ and visual c++?? i mean if i learn visual c++ i can code in c++ withounght changing anything?? (like grammar or syntax)
btw can someone tell me a programme in linux (not gedit plz ^^) to write v.c++ i have tried netbeans but i can't find the compilers and eclipse but i think it is only for java

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#2 stayscrisp  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 05:53 AM

Visual C++ is not a language it is an IDE, learning C++ will mean you can write code in any C++ compiler or IDE.
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#3 NickDMax  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 07:17 AM

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Visual C++ is not a language it is an IDE, learning C++

This is not really correct.

Visual Studio is the IDE -- Visual C++ refers to the language and perhapse the compiler.

The VC++ Compiler has many features that are not standard to C++ (although they do roughly align to other "standards" -- not that anyone other than microsoft has adopts the "standards").

So if you learn C++/CLI (which is an extension to the C++ standard) with Visual C++ then you will find that there are no other compilers (at least I have not found one) that implement this standard.

So the basic answer to your questions is:

VC++ != C++ - If you learn VC++ without learning what parts are C++/CLI and what parts are standard C++ then you will be dased and confused when you meet a real C++ compiler.

On the other hand, if you learn C++ without C++/CLI then you will find that VC++ compiles your programs just fine (at least as well as any other compiler) and you can get along just fine.

VC++ does tend to come with a nice set of proprietary libraries (MFC etc.) which are not going to be available in other compilers -- but then again other compilers generally come with proprietary libraries that are not available to VC++ -- So if you really adopt any particular compiler you are bound to use features that bind you to that compiler.

So if you would like to write a library or something that should be available to many different platforms and compiler, it is advisable to develop and test with a larger set of compilers rather than just VC++ or BCB 2009 or GCC.
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#4 meneltour27  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 11:24 AM

i have a book for vc++ thats why i was asking ... if i get it right it;s better to find a c++ book first and then move to the other one. ty a lot for the answers
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#5 Dantheman  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 01:55 PM

View Postmeneltour27, on 3 Jul, 2009 - 10:24 AM, said:

i have a book for vc++ thats why i was asking ... if i get it right it;s better to find a c++ book first and then move to the other one. ty a lot for the answers


I hardly doubt that your book assumes a pre-existing knowledge of C++. Usually, books that teach VC++ actually teach you C++ then add a bit VC++-specific details on top. So unless it is an advanced-level book, you shouldn't have any trouble jumping right in.
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#6 stayscrisp  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 02:41 PM

Microsoft Visual C++ (often abbreviated as MSVC) is a commercial integrated development environment (IDE) product engineered by Microsoft for the C, C++, and C++/CLI programming languages. :P Wikipedia

@NickDMax I trust what you say though, I haven't had much experience with it.
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#7 Dantheman  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 02:51 PM

View Poststayscrisp, on 3 Jul, 2009 - 01:41 PM, said:

Microsoft Visual C++ (often abbreviated as MSVC) is a commercial integrated development environment (IDE) product engineered by Microsoft for the C, C++, and C++/CLI programming languages.


Well, I find it to be a rather ambiguous distinction. Yes, there are differences between VC++ code and C++ code. But...... what are those differences part of? Are they part of a compiler itself or are they part of a language? Or maybe even both? After all, what is a language without a compiler? So I don't think there's right or wrong, both sides have a point.
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#8 meneltour27  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 03:23 PM

but as you said it is MICROSOFT vc++ so that means that the programmes that i will be writing with the small differences from c++ won't run anywhere else except windows right?

This post has been edited by meneltour27: 03 July 2009 - 03:57 PM

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#9 stayscrisp  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 04:01 PM

View Postmeneltour27, on 3 Jul, 2009 - 02:23 PM, said:

but as you said it is MICROSOFT vc++ so that means that the programmes that i will be writing with the small differences from c++ won't run anywhere else except windows right?


Yeah your right. What these platform specific extensions are I don't know.

I still say that VC++ is the compiler/IDE, extensions or not. A lot of compilers have specific ways of writing some things. Again though my experience with VC++ is quite limited so what do I know :P
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#10 Oler1s  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 05:42 PM

meneltour said:

but as you said it is MICROSOFT vc++ so that means that the programmes that i will be writing with the small differences from c++ won't run anywhere else except windows right?
You misunderstood the point being made. Microsoft VC++ refers to the compiler. You can compile standard C++ programs just fine with it. Stop worrying. If you ask people what compiler, you will be told VC++...

Your VC++ book isn't useless. But none of the really good books about C++ advertise themselves as being VC++ specific. So it's probably worth getting a better book anyway.

Or changing languages. I joke not. If you haven't programmed before, start with Python or C#, and save yourself a lot of initial pain.

This post has been edited by Oler1s: 03 July 2009 - 05:42 PM

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#11 NickDMax  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 03 July 2009 - 06:36 PM

@stayscrisp -- I can't help it is Wikipedia is wrong :P -- It is confusing though, the compiler is actually cl.exe and the IDE is visual studio and MSVC is the combination. My point was just the VC++ has a number of extension that are not standard. It also has a number of proprietary extensions.

In my experience a book that claims to be a Visual C++ book will focus on the C++/CLI features which really are very confusing and have nothing to do with the standard C++ -- keep in mind that Microsoft wants people to adopt the .Net platform and ditch native coding.

That being said, if you are just learning I think that learning from a Visual C++ book is ok, you can pick up the differences later. But -- stick the the book because regular C++ resources are likely to confuse you.
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#12 oppenheimer230  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 05 July 2009 - 12:29 PM

If you are on Windows, Visual C++ is the easiest and "most standard" development environment you could use. Most introductory guides you will find online assume that you are using Visual C++. Furthermore, although there are microsoft-specific extensions that you will only find in Visual C++, the chances that you will encounter them at a beginner level is somewhat unlikely. Finally, it is my belief that, if you are a beginner, then learning about your environment is just as important as learning about the code, so a book on Visual C++ would probably be better for you than one on straight C++.

The express edition of Visual C++ is free. You can get hte professional version for free if you have a student ID at a university.
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#13 NickDMax  Icon User is offline

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Re: c++ vs visual C++

Posted 05 July 2009 - 12:33 PM

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chances that you will encounter them at a beginner level is somewhat unlikely.

I have to disagree -- there are many books and guides that begin with C++/CLI stuff. It is quite likely that if you get a book specifically for Visual C++ you will find a good deal of the .Net stuff (because it is easy to get dialogs and what not with the .Net stuff).
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