[crazyjugglerdrummer]

REFERRING TO GUIS AND FULL FLEDGED APPLICATIONS

I've often heard that Mac is easy to use, but its heck to program.

I haven't done a whole lot with programming mac, but I got a graphical hello world app running in VS C# in about a minute without much prior experience. That wasn't going to happen with mac os x cocoa stuff and interface builded/xcode, but that's just IMHO, I'm not very experienced with it.

Share your thoughts.

This post has been edited by crazyjugglerdrummer: 11 August 2009 - 06:29 PM

[no2pencil]

Linux.

Someone's perception of "easier" will depend on many different things. The OS is rather irrelevant, as someone will most likely be developing on the same OS that they are writing for.

[Tom9729]

I think it really depends which one you're more familiar with. I have an easier time figuring things out on Windows or Linux than I do on OS X because I use them much more frequently.

I kind of agree with no2, although I think in some cases different systems have different interface guidelines so your average Mac app is going to be designed differently than your average Windows app.

One of the wizard-generated "Hello, world!" apps is not a good way to judge a programming environment though. Also keep in mind that there are cross-platform IDEs that run on Windows, Mac, & Linux (Eclipse).

OS X and Linux are nice for software developers because they come with all the tools you need to get started (Xcode, gcc, etc). I would actually like to see something like Microsoft packaging the Express edition of VS with Windows (it could be on a separate disc, or as a non-default installable option like with OS X).

[no2pencil]

Tom9729, on 11 Aug, 2009 - 09:03 PM, said:

OS X and Linux are nice for software developers because they come with all the tools you need to get started (Xcode, gcc, etc)

This was always one of my reasons for pushing Linux onto my friends in the beginning. What I found out, however, was they were more comfortable in downloading one IDE (or package) for Windows development, rather than finding out what tools they needed, then finding where they are, then finding out what their syntax was... & so on.

I'm not at all arguing against your point, more stating that some of the powers of the command line tools are easily hidden to an inexperienced developer.

[Tom9729]

no2pencil, on 11 Aug, 2009 - 10:07 PM, said:

I'm not at all arguing against your point, more stating that some of the powers of the command line tools are easily hidden to an inexperienced developer.

What I mean is that the two big distros I use (Fedora and Debian) both come with compilers for almost every language, several different IDEs along with plugins for each one, a gigantic number of libraries, etc.

I think picking the right tool for the job can be tough when you don't really know what you need and are presented with a thousand choices, but at the same time I think it's pretty cool to be able to say "I want to learn Python", open the package manager and you've got everything you need right there.

I don't have a Mac but I believe Xcode and gcc are included on a separate disc (or at least they used to be). Sure you could go online and download the tools, my point is just that it's pretty cool to have all of that accessible to you right from the start.

[GWatt]

Macs have an interesting programming environment. The objective c base of Cocoa will be difficult to learn at first since the syntax is closer to smalltalk than to C++. There are C++ libraries for the GUI, but they're not as complete or as well documented as their Cocoa counterparts.
Objective C is pretty good language IMO, but it suffers from the 'not invented here' syndrome from Microsoft, and the historical use of C/C++ in standard *nix.

But it all depends on what you want to do. If you want to develop for mac, you will need a mac and xcode. If you want to develop for Windows, will need a windows box and visual studio.

[xCraftyx]

Objective C (the main development language, as GWatt said) is an interesting language and I didn't have a problem learning it; it comes with a shitload of libraries for most tasks. XCode is a nice IDE and it comes free with OSX, it contains an interface builder and everything. As far as full fledged applications go, I've been working on iPhone development so I can't really provide too much advice...though I will say that if you're trying to write polished and native-looking applications I would stick with Objective C instead of trying to use another language.

[markhazlett9]

Although I prefer to program on OS X. Linux is by far the easiest to program on(I find especially Suse to be then best). Anyways, I think that OS X isn't bad by any means and still only done java development on Windows so nothing proprietary to them by any means so I won't really comment on that.

Cheers

[bodom658]

You can't really say that one is easier. Everyone seems to have their own preferences in tools, IDE's, compilers, etc.

It also depends on the programming language. I do a lot of C#, and thus like using Microsoft's Visual Studio 2008 Professional to build applications.

I also like to use vim for C, C++, and Python.

I guess you could say beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[noorahmad]

Windows

[nathanpc]

Depends on what you are going to develop and for what. If you are going to develop iOS applications, so Mac OS X is a must, since there isn't any tool for Windows. In the other side, if you want to develop applications for Windows Phone 7, so Windows is the must, for the same reason of the iOS one. But if your goal is to build applications for desktops, so the best one is the one that the application will be distributed for

[Curtis Rutland]

Quote

OS X and Linux are nice for software developers because they come with all the tools you need to get started (Xcode...

XCode is free, but it doesn't come with a Mac, and it's no longer included on an extra disc. It's a large download. Kinda like Visual Studio Express, in that way. That's free too. It also has an "interface builder."

I've tried to get into development on my Mac, but I honestly find no joy in it, and less need. That's usually what drives me to learn a new development skill: a necessity. I needed to write a web site, so I learned ASP.NET. That sort of thing. I have absolutely no need to start doing Objective-C development. So I haven't done much.

As a personal feeling, Visual Studio blows XCode out of the water as an IDE. Just about everything I've tried on both, VS comes out on top. Again, take that for what it's worth.

The major reason I prefer coding on windows though is because I chose .NET to make a career out of.

[D.Mulroy]

just sayin

But for real, most companies in my area are huge on .Net framework so windows is more in demand here.

This post has been edited by D.Mulroy: 25 January 2011 - 09:29 AM

[dorknexus]

Ad hominen argument fail.

[heyoman1]

Just program in Java and you don't have to worry about what OS you're on.

This post has been edited by heyoman1: 25 January 2011 - 12:38 PM