[CodingNewb]

Alright, so I'm looking to make a game kind of like Mafia Wars- No Way, everyone knows those phail . Anyways, with that behind us, I plan on basically creating a site somewhat like Zynga's, but not with the same outlook of their games (being mostly text-based and nearly replicas of each other with a few name changes here and there). So I want to have maybe 2 or 3 games like Zynga's on this site, but I also want to create a community of Flash somewhat like Miniclip,Nitrome,Armorgames,Newgrounds, etc.

So I was thinking to myself, how am I going to do this? What language? What program? Will I put these on a social networking site? What books? And these main factors appeared:

• Which language is best for making browser/text-based game?
  
• Which language is best for creating a somewhat version of flash such as Farmville?
  
• Which language is proper for creating games such as those seen on miniclip and nitrome? Flash?
  
• Which programming language should be used for the Hi-Scores in the community, Front Page of Featured Members, and things to that character?
  
• What will I use to create some sort of a Saving system. Most Likely a Server?
  
• And others that continued to pile up....

Well, to give you my programming history, it honestly doesn't date very far. I've learned a very slight amount of Java,and I know some basic HTML. I was very interested in Python and considered buying several books, until I saw that it had been classified in the same category as Lua- a child's language . From what I have been reading on here, PHP, Python, and Java sound like the suggestions. I'll learn those languages no matter what it takes. For the flash games, I realize that yes- I will need Flash . So if you have suggestions for any of these factors, they would be greatly be appreciated. Also, if I will need server space, I know of reackspace, but if you have any other suggestions on that, it would also be thanked.

Thanks Ahead of Time,

CodingNewb

This post has been edited by CodingNewb: 04 December 2009 - 06:57 PM

[Dogstopper]

Quote

was very interested in Python and considered buying several books, until I saw that it had been classified in the same category as Lua- a child's language

Grrrr....I love Python, and many major games have small scripts written in Lua... Personally, for this sort of task, I would use Java or Python, but Flash seems like it would work too. I also advise you to look into Java FX to see if that looks promising.

[CodingNewb]

No offense to Python intended, I rediscovered that it was, once again, better than I thought it would be. I have seen a few words here and there on Java FX, any substantial difference than Java? Also, I have seen posts that PHP is just a quick editing language, is this true? Could it do an entire job for me?

This post has been edited by CodingNewb: 04 December 2009 - 06:58 PM

[Dogstopper]

CodingNewb, on 4 Dec, 2009 - 07:53 PM, said:

No offense to Python was trying to be made there, I rediscovered that it was, once again, better than I thought it would be. I have seen a few words here and there on Java FX, any substantial difference than Java?

Yes. It is fact a completely separate platform. Here's my feeble attempt:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JavaFX

Quote

Technical highlights

Common profile. JavaFX is based on the concept of a “Common profile” that is intended to span across all devices supported by JavaFX. This approach makes it possible for developers to use a common programming model while building an application targeted for both desktop and mobile devices and to share much of the code, graphics assets and content between desktop and mobile versions. To address the need for tuning applications for the needs of specific class of devices, the JavaFX 1.1 platform includes APIs that are desktop or mobile-specific. For example JavaFX Desktop profile includes Swing and advanced visual effects.

Drag-to-Install. From the point of view of the end user “Drag-to-Install” allows them to drag a JavaFX widget or application residing in a website within the browser window and drop it onto their desktop. The application will not lose its state or context even after the browser is closed. An application can also be re-launched by clicking on a shortcut that gets automatically created on the user's desktop. This behavior is enabled out-of-the-box by the Java applet mechanism and is leveraged by JavaFX from the underlying Java layer. Sun touts “Drag-to-Install” as opening up of a new distribution model and allowing developers to “break away from the browser”.

Integrating graphics created with third-party tools. JavaFX includes a set of plug-ins for Adobe Photoshop and Illustrator that enable advanced graphics to be integrated directly into JavaFX applications. The plug-ins generate JavaFX Script code that preserves layers and structure of the graphics. Developers can then easily add animation or effects to the static graphics imported. There is also an SVG graphics converter tool (a.k.a. Media Factory) that allows for importing graphics and previewing assets after the conversion to JavaFX format.

As for PHP. I really don't think I'm truly qualified to answer that question because, well, I've never used it.

[CodingNewb]

I see. Thanks for that information. I now may consider using a bit of JavaFX in this project. However, I know it will need several languages. Anyone know certain languages I should learn for certain aspects of this project?

[Dogstopper]

Yes, for simple scripts, I would say Python or Lua could do the trick, but let's see what others have to say as well.

[CodingNewb]

I was once actually very fluent in Lua, been a LONG time since that was true however. And your knowledge has been a vital resource, but I would also appreciate some other input, as I need all the advice for this project that I can get.

[SixOfEleven]

Most browser based games are written in PHP. The reason is that PHP is a server side language and you need to be able to access the server to store player information and such. For your top player's page PHP would be the way to go for example. If you want to make a web browser game I would recommend checking out the following pinned article in the PHP forum. There is a lot of great advice on how to get started making a browser based game. http://www.dreaminco...wtopic31698.htm

Also, check out this pinned article here in the Game Programming forum. It has much advice on how to get started developing games. http://www.dreaminco...wtopic63255.htm

[dsherohman]

CodingNewb, on 5 Dec, 2009 - 01:45 AM, said:

Alright, so I'm looking to make a game kind of like Mafia Wars- No Way, everyone knows those phail .

How "like Mafia Wars" are we talking here? If you just mean you want to do a browser-based text game, then I say "rock on!" If you mean you want to clone MW, duplicate its gameplay, and create yet a-freaking-nother crime-based game, then you might want to try to come up with a more original concept so you don't get lost in the sea of MW clones - unless your primary goal is just to learn how to do it and you don't care whether anyone plays your clone.

(Disclaimer: I am currently in the process of building a browser-based text game which is yet a-freaking-nother space trading/combat/(eventually) exploration game, but I've designed game mechanics which are not just a duplicate of anything I'm aware of being out there and there are a few twists in the setting/tech, so I wouldn't call it a clone of something else. I also started it out purely as a self-education project to learn some new tools, but then it took on a life of its own...)

CodingNewb, on 5 Dec, 2009 - 01:45 AM, said:

- Which language is best for making browser/text-based game?

PHP is the most common choice by far. Python (despite what you later mention having heard) is quite capable of handling it and, by many accounts, a better choice than PHP. Personally, I'm using Perl for mine. You might want to consider Java as a possibility, on the basis that you already know it and it's also a widely-used language in programming for the web. (Unless learning a new language is among your objectives, in which case you should avoid any language you already know.)

CodingNewb, on 5 Dec, 2009 - 01:45 AM, said:

- Which language is best for creating a somewhat version of flash such as Farmville?
- Which language is proper for creating games such as those seen on miniclip and nitrome? Flash?

I believe you'd need to use ActionScript for any Flash game components, but I've never really looked into doing Flash development, so I can't really say. I do seem to recall having heard of tools which will convert other languages to ActionScript, though.

CodingNewb, on 5 Dec, 2009 - 01:45 AM, said:

- Which programming language should be used for the Hi-Scores in the community, Front Page of Featured Members, and things to that character?
- What will I use to create some sort of a Saving system. Most Likely a Server?

Anything persistent and global (such as high score/badge lists, featured members, etc.) would definitely need to be stored on your server, probably getting the information from the Flash components.

For a text game, all game state resides on the server and it just sends HTML/Javascript to the user's browser, so that would be saved on the server as well. Flash games, on the other hand, generally seem to save their game state to files on the user's hard drive (conceptually similar to cookies, but a separate storage area with fewer size/content limitations) and only send score/badge-type information back to the server.

[CodingNewb]

Well, I was orignally intending to make an array of Python games available for download (if that is possible) , but then I realized just how big of an industry that online-gaming really is. Also, I would consider Java, but I bought a book several months ago, and it did me no-good. Now that I know Python can create text-based or browser-based games, it's by far one of my top choices . Partially Contradicting that statement,I would also like to learn PHP, as that seems like the most common way for data transfer, login, etc. Also, thanks for the information about there being tools for translation of Python to actionscript, as that could knock out another Language barrier for me.

Also, I have been wondering if HTML will have me any use in this project, being that :

Quote

PHP is a widely-used general-purpose scripting language that is especially suited for Web development and can be embedded into HTML.

Could it possibly take place of anything needing to be done in HTML?

And, yes I would like to learn multiple Languages, but I do not want to learn a horde of them, taking up all of my time learning them, and not needing them in my project.

Quote

How "like Mafia Wars" are we talking here? If you just mean you want to do a browser-based text game, then I say "rock on!" If you mean you want to clone MW, duplicate its gameplay, and create yet a-freaking-nother crime-based game, then you might want to try to come up with a more original concept so you don't get lost in the sea of MW clones - unless your primary goal is just to learn how to do it and you don't care whether anyone plays your clone.

Well, I was sort of poking fun at, yes, all of the crime-based games , and then the pitiful replicas of everything but the names. But, I would just like to create a text-based game , with a most likely different system than mafia wars (I will post if I come up with this system). Also, I am mainly doing this to build up a community, with the added Zynga effect of course.


Advice to any of my questions/any other useful information is greatly appreciated.

[SixOfEleven]

I would think of PHP as adding server side abilities to HTML. Having an understanding of HTML will be of a benefit to you. For example, if you are developing Java applets they need to be hosted in a web page. You could easily use HTML to host the applet.

The problem with HTML is that it is static. To do interesting things you need client side or server side elements. Client side items are things like Javascript and jQuery. They make the page do interesting things but nothing that they do is persistent. Once the person viewing the page leaves everything they did is lost.

Server side is for communicating with the server and making things that the player does persistent. You would use server side languages to get and save high scores, log players into the game, register accounts and actually play the game.

You will more than likely want a few static web pages on your site so HTLM would be good to pick up. CSS would also be very important to pick up. CSS allows you to have all the styles for your pages in one place and give them a common look easily.

[dsherohman]

CodingNewb, on 5 Dec, 2009 - 02:44 PM, said:

Also, I have been wondering if HTML will have me any use in this project, being that :

Quote

PHP is a widely-used general-purpose scripting language that is especially suited for Web development and can be embedded into HTML.

Could it possibly take place of anything needing to be done in HTML?

I'm afraid not. Unless you want to lock yourself into Flash or other plugin-based technologies (which will only display for users with the appropriate plugins installed), HTML and image files (.jpg, .gif, etc.) are the only things that a browser knows how to display. And it usually finds the images because an HTML page told it where to get them.

The main job of the server-side portion of any web-based application is to create HTML pages for the user's browser to display. So, if you're going to be writing code that generates HTML output, you generally have to know at least a little bit about HTML to do it.

[CodingNewb]

Thanks dsheroman and SixOfEleven. Now that I know that HTML and CSS would be good things to learn, my list (in order from first to last) should look something like this:

-C++
-HTML
-Possibly PHP
-CSS

Notice that neither Java, Python, Javascript, or ActionScript, since I have decided to learn C++ in place of those, and a have a converter for each of those languages.

[Theaegd]

eww, a converter, do it yourself

[CodingNewb]

Lol, I would, but I really don't have the time to Learn 5 extra languages, when I could just convert from C++, doing only partial work.