[codeprada]

Both my sister and cousin are in secondary school and they came to me for help in programming. I checked out the problem and then asked what language they need it in and they told me Pascal. I was like o_O wut? I did eventually make the program they needed but after alot of headache since the syntax is different to C, C++, PHP, Java...etc. The most interesting part though was when I asked why did they pick this language to teach absolute beginners about programming. The response was if you can code in Pascal then you can code in any other language. I was more likely to think that was C since C++, Java, PHP, Javascript and who knows what other languages follow it's basic syntax.

Honestly I think as a beginner language it shouldn't be taught because of the wierd syntax..after all these guys have no idea what a loop or if statement is.

Pascal Example File I\O

Spoiler

program CopyOneByteFile;

var
   mychar : char;
   filein, fileout : text;

begin
   assign (filein, 'c:\file1.txt');
   reset (filein);
   assign (fileout, 'c:\file2.txt');
   rewrite (fileout);
   read (filein, mychar);
   write (fileout, mychar);
   close(filein);
   close(fileout)
end. 

C++ Example File I/O

Spoiler

#include <fstream>

using namespace std;

int main(int argc, char * argv[])
{
    fstream filein("c:\file1.txt", ios::in),
            fileout("c:\file2.txt", ios::out);

    char mychar;

    filein >> mychar;

    fileout << mychar;

    filein.close();

    fileout.close();

    return 0;
} 

You may compare the 2 programs above.

I want to know a few things.
What language did you guys start off with, and what language do you think is best for absolute beginners and why?
N.B.(Everyone should in fact start with pseudo code but in this case I'm looking for a real life language because I'm planning on writing a letter to these guys)

My answer to those questions are:
I started off with QBasic but i think C++ is best for absolute beginners since the syntax is similar to that of many other languages and it is Object-Oriented.

[Nakor]

I'd personally recommend C# for a beginner. It follows the syntax of C++ so it should make it fairly easy to pick up several other languages but it doesn't have all the memory management worries of C++. Plus I think learning OOP is just a little easier to deal with in C# as a beginner since you are not having to deal with multiple files for a single class.

[codeprada]

Nakor, on 09 March 2011 - 09:28 AM, said:

I'd personally recommend C# for a beginner. It follows the syntax of C++ so it should make it fairly easy to pick up several other languages but it doesn't have all the memory management worries of C++. Plus I think learning OOP is just a little easier to deal with in C# as a beginner since you are not having to deal with multiple files for a single class.

thanks for the reply. C++ doesn't require you to have separate files for classes though. it's just a way of better organizing your code. I have played with C# for a day lol then jumped back to C++ (honestly I can't remember why).

[raziel_]

I would say VB its easier then C like syntax because no ; at the end etc other things that makes it more english like typing example:

'C#'
for(int i=0; i<11; i++)
{
//'Do some stuff'
}

'VB'
For i As Integer = 0 To 10
'Do some stuff'
Next i

If you have none programming understanding the VB syntax will help you get the basics (after all its visual basic) pretty much fast and easy. Even if that i start programming on Pascal i still hate Begin End block type of thing. My opinion though

This post has been edited by NoBrain: 09 March 2011 - 06:50 AM

[codeprada]

NoBrain, on 09 March 2011 - 09:49 AM, said:

I would say VB its easier then C like syntax because no ; at the end etc other things that makes it more english like typing example:

'C#'
for(int i=0; i<11; i++)
{
//'Do some stuff'
}

'VB'
For i As Integer = 0 To 10
'Do some stuff'
Next i

If you have none programming understanding the VB syntax will help you get the basics (after all its visual basic) pretty much fast and easy. Even if that i start programming on Pascal i still hate Begin End block type of thing. My opinion though

i actually did jump straight from Qbasic to Visual Basic because as you said the easy syntax. It really did help me to think more logically.

[raziel_]

Same here i did start on Pascal and i quit programing for a long time. Then at the uni. i get C class and i kinda start programming again but the real thing that help me get the logical thinking was a job on VB6. Even that VB6 programs crash with run time errors a lot the easy syntax makes me focus on the logic not on the 43 errors that you would have because you missed ";" somewhere in your C code. Lol i still remember a girl from my class that almost cried because of the errors C compiler throw because of missing ";" at the end or other stuff like that.

This post has been edited by NoBrain: 09 March 2011 - 06:57 AM

[codeprada]

NoBrain, on 09 March 2011 - 09:55 AM, said:

... Even that VB6 programs crash with run time errors a lot the easy syntax makes me focus on the logic not on the 43 errors that you would have because you missed ";" somewhere in your C code. Lol i still remember a girl from my class that almost cried because of the errors C compiler throw because of missing ";" at the end or other stuff like that.

lol it really does get annoying but it's mostly the compiler makes syntax errors a nuisance. the thing about C++ is that it won't complain if you exceed an array boundaries. it'll just return garbage and mess your output up. It also just crashes when you try to read an uninitialized variable or read a pointer that points to nothing. After a while you pick up on your mistakes and know where exactly in your code to start looking but if you're learning it's gonna be hells lol.

[raziel_]

yes that is true but for newbies this can be rly fustrating

[Dormilich]

I started with BASIC, then had a short interlude with Turbo Pascal before I ended up with WebDev languages.

[codeprada]

Dormilich, on 09 March 2011 - 10:45 AM, said:

I started with BASIC, then had a short interlude with Turbo Pascal before I ended up with WebDev languages.

i also switched to webdev languages but just recently got serious with it. thanks for the reply

[Dormilich]

I only started with BASIC because my dad was head of the AI Working Group and thus had access to computers at all.

[lordofduct]

I started with C#, from there I branched out to C++, Java, Javascript, and Actionscript. I then branched again to stuff like python, boo, and PHP. I only recently picked up VB and it took me a while to get into it, way to verbose for my liking after writing in so many terse languages.

I enjoyed starting in C#. It was a nice terse language with no frills. Coming from a math background the C-like syntax was just perfect. It also was unforgiving while not being cryptic. C++ was unforgiven, and when you screwed up it would usually not tell you why, or tell you some odd message unrelated to the actual issue. Where as C# got to the point about what the problem was (well got to the point fine enough).

Personally I select C# because it opens up to probably the most languages, 9 times out of 10 I'm writing in a C-like language. It wasn't difficult to learn. And it's not VB... yeah I'm one of those, what sucks more is I'm one of those, yet my fulltime job is in VB.

This post has been edited by lordofduct: 09 March 2011 - 09:11 AM

[Creecher]

I started with HTML, but I didn't consider it a 'programming language'.


My first programming language was C++. I bought a book at Barnes&Noble and got hooked on it after I got past "Hello, world!". I've always loved creating things, it makes me feel like a god.

[raziel_]

lordofduct, on 09 March 2011 - 06:11 PM, said:

I enjoyed starting in C#. It was a nice terse language with no frills. Coming from a math background the C-like syntax was just perfect. It also was unforgiving while not being cryptic. C++ was unforgiven, and when you screwed up it would usually not tell you why, or tell you some odd message unrelated to the actual issue. Where as C# got to the point about what the problem was (well got to the point fine enough).

Yes that is true C++ do rly shows unrelated the the error messages come to think of it. You have to admit that C# intelisence is way better then C/C++.

[Dormilich]

NeverPool, on 09 March 2011 - 05:34 PM, said:

I started with HTML, but I didn't consider it a 'programming language'.

that's because it ain’t a programming language.