[himynameisbede]

I'm looking at getting into programming and there is a one year course at Computer Power that you can do. You can major in either Java or C# and VB.NET. I'm just wondering which one I should choose if I wanted to work for a big gaming studio? Would it matter? Because I've heard that C++ is the biggest gaming language but obviously its not an option here.

Also on another note, how much better is a 3 year computer science degree in comparison to this? (in terms of getting a good job)

http://www.computerp...are-development


Thanks guys

[Oler1s]

Here's the truth. Tools focused courses are garbage.

If you want experience with tools, it's going to be a combination of you learning by yourself, writing actual programs, and working with other people on large projects. In other words, everything but courses.

If you want to do courses, you should go through a proper computer science program. That's CS theory so look at the syllabus of any well known university (for its CS program) and look at the course material that CS students go through. That's what you want to be doing academically.

While you go through the academics, on your own time, you need to be gaining experience with the craft of programming. That involves taking your own time to learn programming languages, write programs, join projects, and work on something of complexity.

Coursework is ignored unless it's theory and computer science from a reputed university.

[himynameisbede]

Thanks for the reply,

How come they are rubbish? And what are some good ways of joining projects?

[Oler1s]

> How come they are rubbish?

Courses are not good mediums to gain proficiency. The correct mediums are experience, which requires time investment, doing work and learning from your mistakes, and understanding technical details, which involves reading books and documentation.

Courses are good at structure. Books provide this as well, and experienced programmers will just look at books and documentation. So when I say structure, I mean structure for beginner programmers. Unfortunately, you can get really good beginner books as well, so you might not even care for a course.

Let's say you still wanted the structure of a course. You're then reliant on having a good teacher who can guide you properly. Unfortunately, they are all out working and making good money, or doing something more interesting as a programmer. Basically, this course is a money making mill, because the real value is elsewhere.

I think that's your biggest challenge. Structuring your learning at the beginning. If you can do this on your own, you can get started all by yourself, and do a better job of teaching yourself.

> And what are some good ways of joining projects?

For a beginner, there isn't much. The typical recommendation is an open source project, but open source projects are not beginner learning schools either. But once you've hit an intermediate level as a programmer, you can start looking at open source projects that require help. Going to hackathons, and other developer centered events in your local area is another option. If you're in a university, there may be fellow student projects and organizations you can get a hold of. But the big thing is going to be just doing some professional work. A bit of a catch 22, but there it is. Internships are one entry point for beginners to do professional level work.

[macosxnerd101]

Quote

How come they are rubbish?

Some courses provide excellent structure. A lot of them don't, and they teach a lot of poor practices at the beginning. I see a lot of introductory Java courses making the mistake of jumping into things like GUI and Graphics programming without giving students a firm foundation in OOP. It doesn't make sense.

[himynameisbede]

So basically when it comes down to it, I could just teach myself, get involved with projects, and if my work is good, I would be able to gain employment? Sweet. I actually just ordered a book... Head First Java.

Thanks for the advice!

[Serapth]

himynameisbede, on 06 December 2011 - 11:24 PM, said:

So basically when it comes down to it, I could just teach myself, get involved with projects, and if my work is good, I would be able to gain employment? Sweet. I actually just ordered a book... Head First Java.

Thanks for the advice!

Well if nothing else, you picked a pretty good book to start with.

The head first series is actually quite good.

[himynameisbede]

Quote

Well if nothing else, you picked a pretty good book to start with.

The head first series is actually quite good.

Oh is it? Sweet.

And for interest sake... Would anyone know the average amount of time you would have to spend learning how to program (eg 1 year?) before you could get a job from it? Because I just found out that the IT learning institute I was thinking about going to has a job placement program and is successful with about 90% of its graduates (after 1 year of study)? That seems like quite a short period of time to me...

This post has been edited by SixOfEleven: 08 December 2011 - 06:08 AM
Reason for edit:: Fixed quote tags

[Serapth]

Not an easy question to answer, as a ) people have different capacities to learn B ) people measure time differently.

I mean, frankly there is a massive difference between "a week", when its full-time or spare-time hours.


Generally, at least in Canada, a 2-3 year program is pretty much considered the minimum level of respectability. There are programs that teach you to program in 9 months, but frankly, they aren't well regarded. I am not saying they can't teach you in that time period ( although I have my doubts ), just they aren't really viewed well over all.


Then again, education is massively different from state to state, country to country, company to company, so what I view as truth means very little in other areas.


One area to look at for a real metric though is immigration. Look into the qualifications for an H1B visa for example, as those I suppose are the measuring stick as set by the government for a "real" education. I believe its a 3 year program, but don't quote me, I haven't looked in ages.


// Edit: This is going to be the most scrooge-esque thing I have ever said, but is there a way to flat out turn off smilies? On a programmer forum they are downright annoying.

This post has been edited by Serapth: 07 December 2011 - 04:28 PM

[stayscrisp]

You don't like to smile it's almost christmas

[Serapth]

stayscrisp, on 08 December 2011 - 02:18 AM, said:

You don't like to smile it's almost christmas

Bah humbug!