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#1 LittleSoul  Icon User is offline

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On the fence of framework?

Posted 08 June 2012 - 10:46 PM

I'm in the stages of designing/planning my project (a pbbg), and I'm still on the fence about which framework to choose. It's between PHP, or RoR. When it comes to learning the language, I know I can do it either way I go.

The problem is, I've been doing some research, and I've seen a lot of widely differing opinions between the two. Given, some of those opinions were from up to 4 years ago, and I'm certain things have changed with Ruby's updates.

But, I'm still on the fence. Does Ruby still have "problems with scaling"?

Ruby looks pretty easy to learn, and it even looks fun; but I'm skeptical about whether or not I'd be safer going down the more established PHP route. I've seen some say that a text based game isn't suitable with Ruby, and others say it works just fine. Which is true these days?

I couldn't find much info on Ruby's homepage, and like I said, my research elsewhere just made it more difficult to choose.

Any advice, tips, suggestions, and opinions would be appreciated!

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Replies To: On the fence of framework?

#2 xclite  Icon User is offline

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Re: On the fence of framework?

Posted 08 June 2012 - 10:51 PM

I'll never get this "problems with scaling" bullshit argument. The question isn't "can this language scale" it's "are you capable of writing scalable code?" Ruby can do anything PHP can do. Neither is more scalable than the other. A text-based game is probably EASIER in Ruby because it's a more readable language, but that's all opinion. Ruby's scaling is asymptotically no different than that of php, and anybody who parrots that argument doesn't have the brains to actually formulate it.

My vote is whichever language you find yourself more comfortable in. Rails is certainly capable (and there are many other Ruby frameworks) as are frameworks based on php.
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#3 LittleSoul  Icon User is offline

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Re: On the fence of framework?

Posted 08 June 2012 - 11:08 PM

Thank you so much.
I really didn't know what to think about those claims I've read. I really love Ruby already, just playing with the interactive tutorials.

It's just that I'm brand spanking new to most of this, and considering how much work I've already put into designing my project (probably a few months by now), I just wanted to be sure that the framework I really like is something I'm not going to have problems with, after everything's said and done, due to the language itself. If I have problems, I'll feel much better knowing they're problems with my actual programming skills.

Thank you very much for your opinion xclite.
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#4 xclite  Icon User is offline

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Re: On the fence of framework?

Posted 08 June 2012 - 11:35 PM

At a high level, your design can be independent of the language. The way I decided which frameworks I liked was to make a simple CRUD(create, read, update, delete) interface to a database. That gets a lot of the simple intro stuff out of the way and you get a feel for how things are done.
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#5 blackcompe  Icon User is offline

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Re: On the fence of framework?

Posted 09 June 2012 - 12:02 AM

One source of the "Ruby can't scale" rumour came from Twitter's inability to handle a growing number of users at one point. They eventually found it wasn't because of Ruby, but rather because of its architecture. Here's an interesting discussion on RoR's scalability. And another on Twitter and RoR. I agree with xclite: it's the design decisions, not the language.

I really can't recommend Ruby over PHP, because I haven't used any PHP frameworks, but I can tell you Ruby is a pleasure to use. The language is so elegant and expressive. I really like Rails' "convention over configuration" philosophy. It makes designing CRUD apps a cinch. You also might want to look into Haml.

I guess it's worth mentioning too that most scalability issues lie within the persistence tier. In the accepted answer to that SO post (linked above), the responder talks mainly about having to deal with issues in the ORM layer.

This post has been edited by blackcompe: 09 June 2012 - 12:08 AM

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#6 LittleSoul  Icon User is offline

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Re: On the fence of framework?

Posted 09 June 2012 - 08:31 AM

Thank you both.

Those articles were really helpful; I had no idea that twitter had scalability problems, or the many other large sites for that matter.

In my case, I doubt I'll have -that- much traffic, but you never know. (:

I really like Ruby's philosophy as well. It -does- look beautiful. I can't wait to really dig into it.

Thanks you guys. I got the answers and the push I needed!
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#7 NotarySojac  Icon User is offline

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Re: On the fence of framework?

Posted 12 June 2012 - 07:37 AM

Lol, I love this website.
http://canrailsscale.com/
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