[Skydiver]

snoopy11, on 04 July 2012 - 12:20 PM, said:

ishkabible, on 04 July 2012 - 06:07 PM, said:

There will still be a more devolpment oriented side to this; perhaps just *nix based OSs but I think windows and even apple will still allow for devolpment just as much. Less technically friendly interfaces, like those that Metro may push forth, probably wont work for advanced devolpment tools and simply wont be used.

Yes it will be interesting to see how advanced development tools are supposed to work in this new OS,

Some think the OS will not work and won't be used.

However, both Apple and Microsoft are very large organisations and this new 'store' concept that of course started with Apple is very appealing both to the end user and of course the OS manufacturer.

Where it leaves the hobbyist programmer or small independent developer is another question entirely.

This is the big plus for Windows 8. Hope for a unified place to find applications and hopefully a consistent seamless experience installing and using applications.

[GunnerInc]

Quote

Yes it will be interesting to see how advanced development tools are supposed to work in this new OS,

Yes and it would be interesting to see how many companies are going to spend the thousands of dollars on licenses to upgrade. Spend the money retraining folks to use something different than they have used for decades.

I don't see it happening. I won't be getting Win8 any years soon. Windows 7 is their best/solid OS to date. They seem to go through this cycle, create a new great version of Windows, and not happy with their income, create another one that is total crap... repeat this cycle.

I won't use a touch screen, I like my screen to be eye level, not looking down at it.

I can upgrade my computer to anything I want, add a 48" screen if I wanted to, can you do this with a touch screen thingie? Nope, you have to buy a new bigger and faster one.

The are going to alienate a solid user base - corporations and users.

[snoopy11]

Skydiver, on 04 July 2012 - 07:19 PM, said:

I'd like to see Autocad or Photoshop without menus, toolbars, and tool palettes.

And I'd like to see you pry away the stylus, mouse, and other input devices your graphic artists are using and tell them that they have to use the touch screen to do all their work.

And do you really expect these graphic professionals to be sitting at their desk and reaching out to their screens all day long?

I'd like to see how many paralegals will continue writing and editing legal briefs without a keyboard. I'm quite sure they'll have one stashed by their desk.

Or better yet, I'd like to see you write code and debug C++ code on a touch screen without a keyboard.

On the other hand, if Windows 8 finally kills windbg, I'll breaking out the champagne bottles! But wait, Win8 SDK still ships with windbg. Bottles will have to continue chilling a while longer. :-(

There will still be graphic Tablets for photoshop and autocad of course there will, probably all wifi(wirelessly) connected.
It will take time to make these adjustments, I have thought of this.

Some people will still want a keyboard and mouse again these will be provided but eventually people will move to pinching , swiping and the 'rollup keyboard' on a touch screen because eventually it will be easier.

It's not going to happen overnight, I think the change will be gradual.

Most change is gradual anyway.

Older people will always have their keyboards and mice.

Younger people who grow up with touchscreen technology won't.

[modi123_1]

Yawn... shifting and nebulous answers to solid rebuttals is boring. You're timeframe seems to blend everything from a year to twenty years. Wonderful. Take a lap and calm down. Change happens - we know that. Trying to get all panicky about the far future now is just a waste of energy. If it still bothers you - chillax (as jon.kiparsky would say) - Startrek indicates there were touch pads in the future but consoles were where the main shit went down.

[snoopy11]

GunnerInc, on 04 July 2012 - 07:28 PM, said:

Yes and it would be interesting to see how many companies are going to spend the thousands of dollars on licenses to upgrade. Spend the money retraining folks to use something different than they have used for decades.

I don't see it happening. I won't be getting Win8 any years soon. Windows 7 is their best/solid OS to date. They seem to go through this cycle, create a new great version of Windows, and not happy with their income, create another one that is total crap... repeat this cycle.

I won't use a touch screen, I like my screen to be eye level, not looking down at it.

I can upgrade my computer to anything I want, add a 48" screen if I wanted to, can you do this with a touch screen thingie? Nope, you have to buy a new bigger and faster one.

The are going to alienate a solid user base - corporations and users.

Windows 7 is indeed a great OS I mention that in my Original Post, its so fast and stable its unreal.

Windows 8 is a bit of an unknown, I agree.

You might not want to use a touchscreen but look at the younger ones on their iPhones , iPads and iPod Touches the rollup screens are no problem to them they type on them at a speed I can only dream about with two hands.
The younger ones love the swiping and pinching even my four year old gets it right away, no training involved it all comes to them like they were born to it, the teenagers are of course lightyears ahead in that respect.

I'm an Engineer, I love building new PC's and upgrading them I love it, sadly me and you are a dying breed and I don't think we will be catered for.

As for corporations yes they may stick with Windows 7 for a long while, it just maybe easier but in the long term, I think that will be a different story as well.

[snoopy11]

modi123_1, on 04 July 2012 - 07:38 PM, said:

Yawn... shifting and nebulous answers to solid rebuttals is boring. You're timeframe seems to blend everything from a year to twenty years. Wonderful. Take a lap and calm down. Change happens - we know that. Trying to get all panicky about the far future now is just a waste of energy. If it still bothers you - chillax (as jon.kiparsky would say) - Startrek indicates there were touch pads in the future but consoles were where the main shit went down.

Right,

I never said anything about this taking a year it will be longer, I never said it will take twenty years either it will be shorter than that.

probably 8 to 10 years is all it will take.

If it's boring I am not forcing you to read it.

I am not getting all panicky about the future, au contraire, I am embracing the future, and I think this it, If I am wrong then in the future I will say 'I was wrong, you were right' I will be a big enough man to do that.

As for Star Trek wasnt it all voice activated..?

Just saying.. sure there were Tablets on Star Trek but I remember them saying 'Computer ..?' quite a lot for their big mainframes don't remember much swiping, pinching and rollup keyboards though.

Just kidding.

This post has been edited by snoopy11: 04 July 2012 - 12:58 PM

[Skydiver]

snoopy11, on 04 July 2012 - 12:51 PM, said:

Just saying.. sure there were Tablets on Star Trek but I remember them saying 'Computer ..?' quite a lot for their big mainframes don't remember much swiping, pinching and rollup keyboards though.

I thought that Kirk managed to get a lot of swiping, pinching, and rolling going in Star Trek.

[lordofduct]

I still stand by what I said... dingle putz, that might be even better.

[Skydiver]

What about First Person Shooters, and other twitchy games on Windows 8? Do these get relegated to XBoxes with, guess what, controllers?

Or will a player at home have to heft around his 24" LCD display with built in accelerometers to effect the inputs for movements? Well that is one way to make PC gamers get a workout. :-)

Or is Kinect and other kinect-like input the future for twitchy games? If Descent ever makes a comeback, this would make for interesting living room setups.

Beyond twitchy games, Flight sim on a touch screen is going to be fun. Flight sims are completely content based, but I don't think it it amenable to touch interface... Yeah: run thumbs along left-right edges for adjusting trim. Big finger movement in middle third of screen for throttle, and big finger movements centered on middle of screen of yoke, while rudder is finger along bottom edge of screen... And then when it's time to get in the seat of a real C-152, do you ask the FAA examiner: where's the touchscreen?

[snoopy11]

Skydiver, on 04 July 2012 - 08:05 PM, said:

snoopy11, on 04 July 2012 - 12:51 PM, said:

Just saying.. sure there were Tablets on Star Trek but I remember them saying 'Computer ..?' quite a lot for their big mainframes don't remember much swiping, pinching and rollup keyboards though.

I thought that Kirk managed to get a lot of swiping, pinching, and rolling going in Star Trek.

Well maybe swiping and rolling he was too manly
for pinching, girlie stuff pinching...

lordofduct, on 04 July 2012 - 08:16 PM, said:

I still stand by what I said... dingle putz, that might be even better.

Good for you,

I am sure you are a wonderful person and
your mental age doesn't hold you back in any
way at all..

[snoopy11]

Skydiver, on 04 July 2012 - 08:29 PM, said:

What about First Person Shooters, and other twitchy games on Windows 8? Do these get relegated to XBoxes with, guess what, controllers?

Or will a player at home have to heft around his 24" LCD display with built in accelerometers to effect the inputs for movements? Well that is one way to make PC gamers get a workout. :-)

Or is Kinect and other kinect-like input the future for twitchy games? If Descent ever makes a comeback, this would make for interesting living room setups.

Beyond twitchy games, Flight sim on a touch screen is going to be fun. Flight sims are completely content based, but I don't think it it amenable to touch interface... Yeah: run thumbs along left-right edges for adjusting trim. Big finger movement in middle third of screen for throttle, and big finger movements centered on middle of screen of yoke, while rudder is finger along bottom edge of screen... And then when it's time to get in the seat of a real C-152, do you ask the FAA examiner: where's the touchscreen?

Yeah you do have a valid point there,
Are games just supposed to go on a console

Those console games are very expensive
Not everyone will like that...

But as for flight sims I am sure there will be
wireless Joysticks might even be better sitting on the
couch in front of a giant screen with a joystick.

Who knows...

But a good point well made

[turboscrew]

It may also happen that Microsoft blackmails the users too far and gets dropped from the market. But not very soon...

I guess, if M$ is going for tablets/smart phones, the hobbyists will probably move towards rack machines.

There is really movement towards a model that "ecosystems" create most of the applications. Even M$ can't fight that. Closed systems have tendency to die - now more than before.

I must say, I'm a bit disappointed to the laptops. With the money you can get a good desktop, you get a piece of junk for a laptop.

Also about windows 7, I work with machine running windows 7.
I wouldn't praise it so highly.

I have about 500 GB hard disk and I still tend to run out of disk space. Why? Have you checked the sizes of all the freaking frameworks you are "compelled" to use when writing SW to the "new glorious" systems.

Think of Firefox. Lately they have been having linking problems:
4 GB virtual memory (32-bit address space) is not big enough to link a lousy web browser.

[modi123_1]

Quote

Closed systems have tendency to die - now more than before.

Apple says what?

[wordswords]

I think the desktop computer, as a mode of interaction, is going to be around for a long while. This is because it's more comfortable and ergonomic to be at your desk while using a computer. Whether the computer that you are going to interact with is a tablet, a connected/smart TV, or a mobile phone hooked up to a monitor and keyboard.. it's still a desktop computer.

Will Windows 8 change everything? It might make it easier for us to develop across multiple devices with its tablet interface. I certainly don't think it will change 'everything'. Most of my applications run server-side or in a browser anyway, I can't see that changing. For those people that will find it difficult shifting from developing PC applications to developing tablet/PC applications, I feel a bit sorry for them, because software development is all about adapting to new technologies, and that's certainly not going to stop after Windows 8 is released.

[Lemur]

They can have my keyboard, mouse, and gfx tablet over my cold dead body.

Regardless, if you have to give a company a crappy catch phrase nickname your argument is probably garbage as well. Let your arguments stand for themselves and quit with the elementary school crap.