Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

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37 Replies - 2009 Views - Last Post: 08 November 2012 - 08:37 AM

#16 Python_4_President  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 03:38 PM

View PostBenignDesign, on 07 November 2012 - 02:05 PM, said:

It never ceases to amaze me how all the people are "sheeple", except the people who use the word "sheeple" on the internet.



Whoa, there, pardner.. I shop at Wal-Mart and eat at McDonalds like everybody else.

Don't go off putting words in my feral mouth, now!
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#17 BenignDesign  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 07:43 PM

View PostPython_4_President, on 07 November 2012 - 04:02 PM, said:

and how much they respect the American sheeple.. I mean people.. I mean subhuman trash, or wait, what? robots. That's what. Or maybe it's dumb animals. Yeah, that's the one.


I didn't put anything in your mouth that you didn't spew forth to begin with.
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#18 creativecoding  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:17 PM

Do people ever use scantrons? I mean, instantly, you have a hard copy and one in some database. Instant results, ability to view your vote online, along with an unmodified hard copy stored somewhere if you think your vote was modified/not what you chose.
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#19 BenignDesign  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:22 PM

But then there's all that concern about using a no2pencil and having to train people to fill in the oval COMPLETELY... and they still fuck it up. And then you get those lazy kids who don't really care and they just make pictures out of the dots and screw things up for everyone else...

Spoiler

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#20 creativecoding  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:26 PM

And it also weeds out the idiots? Perfect!

SCANTRON 2016
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#21 Python_4_President  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:27 PM

View PostBenignDesign, on 07 November 2012 - 08:22 PM, said:

But then there's all that concern about using a no2pencil and having to train people to fill in the oval COMPLETELY... and they still fuck it up. And then you get those lazy kids who don't really care and they just make pictures out of the dots and screw things up for everyone else...

Spoiler

see? you get it. dumb animals. that's what people are.

or were you complimenting me? i misunderstand things pretty often. did you mean i am a higher being because i use the word "sheeple" on the internet?

I'd say the ONLY differentiating factor in my self would be the fact that I acknowledge (and constantly compensate for) my imperfections. That's something a lot of people absolutely refuse to do. (at least the acknowledging part, anyhow.)

I thank Payday Monsanto for my acquisition of the wonderful term, "Sheeple".

This post has been edited by Python_4_President: 07 November 2012 - 08:36 PM

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#22 jon.kiparsky  Icon User is online

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:27 PM

The history of voter fraud suggests that it's a very bad idea to leave the voter in posession of an easy way to prove that they voted a certain way. This is an invitation for clever people to use threats and inducements to sway a person's vote, since they know that there is a way to verify that the vote was cast in the desired way.
Some people, more cynical than I am or less good at economics, have suggested that this might be a good way to subsidize the poor, giving them an easy way to raise needed money by selling their vote to the highest bidder. I suggest this makes as much sense as giving a child in Africa a $100 laptop to sell for whatever the market will bear - it would certainly put $20 in the voter's pocket, but it would be more cost-effective in the long run to just give the kid a Jackson and be done with it.

EDIT: Hey, it's also against the law in Massachusetts:

Quote

“Whoever, at a primary, caucus or election, places any distinguishing mark upon his ballot, or makes a false statement as to his ability to mark his ballot, or allows the marking of his ballot to be seen by any person for any purpose not authorized by law, or gives a false answer to or makes a false oath before a presiding officer, shall be punished by imprisonment for not more than six months or by a fine of not more than one hundred dollars.”

This post has been edited by jon.kiparsky: 07 November 2012 - 08:33 PM

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#23 Python_4_President  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:51 PM

Money and electronics appear to be less effective than...

Bribing voters with pot in 2011!

and again in LA 2012
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#24 jon.kiparsky  Icon User is online

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 08:59 PM

As long as you have no way of rewarding people for voting one way or another, it seems to me not an issue. I mean, I could take your pot and vote against you and there's nothing you could do about it because you wouldn't know. So this seems to me no more outlandish than running busses from the old folks home to the polling places.
Now, if you get a printed receipt for your vote, then you can tell granny "the only way you're getting on this bus to come back is if you show me a Romney receipt". And then we've got a bit of a problem.

(And in your first case, they weren't even giving people dope for voting anyway, it was for filling out a registration card.)

This post has been edited by jon.kiparsky: 07 November 2012 - 09:02 PM

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#25 Python_4_President  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 09:15 PM

View Postjon.kiparsky, on 07 November 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

As long as you have no way of rewarding people for voting one way or another, it seems to me not an issue. I mean, I could take your pot and vote against you and there's nothing you could do about it because you wouldn't know. So this seems to me no more outlandish than running busses from the old folks home to the polling places.
Now, if you get a printed receipt for your vote, then you can tell granny "the only way you're getting on this bus to come back is if you show me a Romney receipt". And then we've got a bit of a problem.

(And in your first case, they weren't even giving people dope for voting anyway, it was for filling out a registration card.)


I think the point was just to get people to vote in the first place. I was just noting that it was an effective strategy.

Honor system is the best system, IMO. Receipts are for suckers.
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#26 jon.kiparsky  Icon User is online

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 09:18 PM

So, completely irrelevant, then?
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#27 Python_4_President  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 09:27 PM

View Postjon.kiparsky, on 07 November 2012 - 09:18 PM, said:

So, completely irrelevant, then?



Not completely.. I'm sure you could spend a good few hours cooking up some boolean logic to describe the impact of offering pot to people to get out and vote.

If there's an issue on the table, with a yes or a no vote available...

then if, of all the people in the area, the expected amount voted in the ways they will, a result would be obtained.
If, however, pot was offered to a subset of all the people in the area to get out and vote, it would be reasonable to think that the result would be different.

So no, not completely irrelevant, just a little more difficult to account for.
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#28 jon.kiparsky  Icon User is online

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 09:29 PM

View PostPython_4_President, on 07 November 2012 - 11:27 PM, said:

View Postjon.kiparsky, on 07 November 2012 - 09:18 PM, said:

So, completely irrelevant, then?



Not completely..

Close enough, though.

Say, was that what got you to vote?
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#29 Python_4_President  Icon User is offline

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 09:50 PM

Nah, I'd call the cops on anyone who tried that stunt on me.

Down here in Texas we keep that stuff illegal to keep up the good work ethic our great state is known for.

I've seen plenty of guys come through various organizations, do well, get mixed up with the wrong people, and then the bottom falls out and all of a sudden all you ever see them doing is socializing, browsing facebook on their phones, or complaining about how hot it is and how much work sucks.

No mercy for the dopers.

This post has been edited by Python_4_President: 07 November 2012 - 09:54 PM

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#30 jon.kiparsky  Icon User is online

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Re: Pencil & Paper isn't good enough, we need it now.

Posted 07 November 2012 - 09:56 PM

You sure? Seems like you might have had a little taste recently. Just a tad bit.
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