2D game vs 3D game

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24 Replies - 1107 Views - Last Post: 07 February 2013 - 10:27 AM Rate Topic: -----

#16 Pwn  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 31 January 2013 - 03:29 PM

The point I'm trying to get across is, I've got plenty of attitude, but I am able to put that aside and ask nicely. But it seems that no matter how much information I give, or how well I word it, the prevalent answer is, you didn't give enough information for me to answer your question, or you don't know enough to do what you say you're trying to do.

Really, what does what I'm trying to do have anything to do with the specific question I'm asking? I give you all the relevant information available to me at the time, if I thought you needed more than that, I'd have included it.

If you don't know, just say you don't know, or better yet, don't say anything. If you can help, help. Anything else is not helpful. Don't muddy the water.
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#17 modi123_1  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 31 January 2013 - 04:02 PM

Quote

The point I'm trying to get across is, I've got plenty of attitude, but I am able to put that aside and ask nicely. But it seems that no matter how much information I give, or how well I word it, the prevalent answer is, you didn't give enough information for me to answer your question, or you don't know enough to do what you say you're trying to do.

So you don't provide enough information - it's not a big deal. Try not to externalize your upset behavior on everyone else.

As for the "you don't know enough" - well yes. I have no recollection of your past posts, but when you have a goal of Z that's great. Don't get angry when people explain you cannot just go from A to Z without knowing B, C, D, etc.. I know have I have personally seen many projects get mothballed because the individual really really wanted to be at Z *RIGHT NOW*, and got pissed at step B... or just skipped to W and became super frustrated at there because nothing made sense.

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Really, what does what I'm trying to do have anything to do with the specific question I'm asking? I give you all the relevant information available to me at the time, if I thought you needed more than that, I'd have included it.

It matters quite a bit. Why recommend Unity for a Pong game? why recommend XNA when you want it to run on a mac? Why tell you to have the kiddos build an engine but oh wait.. they are eight years old. Maybe all you need is Darkbasic, but it doesn't do you any good talking about Torque. There is no one road panacea, but we can help narrow the search space down. That's the joys of asking help from people that have a better handle on the area because they can infer what you may need best even though you lack the footing to even ask that right question.

Quote

If you don't know, just say you don't know, or better yet, don't say anything. If you can help, help. Anything else is not helpful. Don't muddy the water.

*sigh* See that is the rub. I *may* know something to add, but I need clarification. I mean.. hells bells I know quite a bit, but I would not expect you to know ahead of time what I need clarification on. That would be silly and down right spooky. So kudos for having what you think covers everyone's needs, but stop fuming when people need to ask for more information. It's a conversation. It happens.


There you squeezed enough cares out of me to explain it (again).
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#18 Pwn  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 31 January 2013 - 04:44 PM

modi, your entire last post is an admission that you read none of my posts IN THIS VERY THREAD. I laid every bit of that out, even saying I was planning a "SpaceRangers 2 type game", key word here is planning. Yet you come in like I'm some noob who doesn't even know what color my asshole is. That's fine, keep it to yourself, I won't be asking for anything else.

This post has been edited by Pwn: 31 January 2013 - 04:55 PM

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#19 anonymous26  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 31 January 2013 - 06:25 PM

This thread has so gone off track.

Pwn, can I ask you a direct question? What makes you think you are NOT noob when it comes to game development?
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#20 Nekroze  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 31 January 2013 - 06:53 PM

2c before my answer: They are looking for information to help you with so they can give you decent suggestions that are better tailored to you however you seem to be reluctant to answer them, how old are your children and what kind of OS do you want to run the game on just some simple stuff. However i know that the attitudes around can seem a touch arrogant and then if you question it directly it becomes way arrogant.

The reason for this seems to be that, in the first place they are not arrogant, they are however acutely aware of the fact they have to step on some of the preconceptions you have of how knowledgeable you are just to answer you in a realist way that doesn't waste your time and theirs and end up damaging your learning experience. They know this has to happen so i don't think they try to even thinly veil it anymore. That being said and because of the way it works people get annoyed at them very often and as the more common users and leaders of the forums get flamed more and more they put up less and less of a veil in front of the initial questions and more harshly respond to flame just for their trying to help as best as they think they can.

Now on to my answer:
We have no idea of your end platform or of the age of your children.

So without any child age i will advise against going with 3d so as to avoid any (even moderately) complex math that may deter them from wanting to work on the game rather then allow them to enjoy the process.

Without any idea of what platform you want to go with i will have to recommend something rather cross platform so i would say use python.

I have had more fun programming in python then any other language and it is very easy as you can learn the basics and just have things work and you don't have to even learn the more advanced aspects of python just to get a decent resulting game.

For a game engine as i don't know the age of your children or how long you want to spend on it, and see this is where 'as long as it takes' doesn't cut it, if you wanted to make a 3d game engine then your game and your kids where 10 they would likely move out of home before you all finish it together or it would just be a horrible mess of a game engine. most of those years you would see nothing coming out of the engine to drive them to continue.

So stick with 2d and use a 2d multimedia library. For python i would recommend Pygame. Pygame is a python wrapper around SDL and allows software rendering of 2d graphics, its not the fastest graphics library around but if you are making it churn then likely you are doing something wrong or are still using a pentium 3... Pygame has some features beyond standard SDL to help you out and there are a great deal of information and examples around the web on how to use it. Also as it is a media library you do have to implement some things yourself, they have a sprite graphical object but they have no logic behind out a sprite should move or collide as this would be rather specific to your game so its halfway between writing a game engine and not, which i think is a very good thing and is still years faster then doing it all.

Making a 2d game in python with Pygame will allow you to really get into making the game and seeing results faster, which is always good for newcomers such as children, python will allow anyone to learn to code as it skips of over of the brain hurting concepts of other languages used for game development and Pygame uses SDL which is also used from many other languages and is a great starting point for learning others.

Because doing it this way would shave many years off of the idea of making and using a 3d game engine to build a game from scratch you will have more time to progress in the knowledge of you or your kids. At which time you could stick with python and learn Pyglet, this uses GPU accelerated opengl and is capable of 2d and 3d although 3d performance may be a bit hard.

In the future i would take a look at the D programming language and their Derelict3 bindings or whatever is out in the future. It is a very power and fast language that is quite similar to c/c++ but without all the mess, if you know how to code D you can pick up c++ quite quickly but c++ will always be a pain compared to D. Derelict3 is a collection of bindings to many things including SDL SFML (like sdl but gpu accelerated) and openGL.

So i hope you can see how i had to make large assumptions and am giving a more generalized answer then i could be but also don't blame the higher ups for getting annoyed they have people flame them for the most random stuff every day all day and most of the time they are really doing their best to help.

Hope i have been of assistance and not just come in and pissed everyone off :stuart:
Nekroze
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#21 Java Student  Icon User is online

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 01 February 2013 - 09:44 PM

Pwn, i think you have misinterpreted the suggestions from some of the people who have posted here. People on here are merely trying to gather information before they can proceed to your actual question. I think you have brought up a few inappropriate family matters in this programming forum that would be better dealt with by a therapist.

I am assumeing your current knowledge of programming which is little-to-none. I think 3d is out of the question, and 2d games are the point at which you and your kids should be starting. Fellow posters have given great advice such as game-makers, especially suitable for the kids, and other things like pygame. A lot of us here have written both 2d and 3d games, but we cannot help you if you take offence very easily. Also, lets get this straight, noone has called you an idiot, stupid, or not "leet" enough for this forum.

You don't have defend not being a noob. If you know little about game development in a game development forum, you are a noob, and should admit this to yourself and move onto LEARNING because that is what this forum is all about.

I'm amazed that you have gotten people on here riled up enough to give you an extensive response to your nonsensical posts.
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#22 samirashafir  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 04 February 2013 - 12:04 AM

There may be difference between 2D and 3D there is a vast difference 3D will be more accurate for the game
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#23 Pwn  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 07 February 2013 - 07:18 AM

What you don't understand is,
1) I'm not asking you to write any code, I haven't got that far yet, so it doesn't matter what I'm trying to code game-wise, as I haven't got that far yet, and,
2) I have no misconceptions of my abilities to create a game, I know I'm a noob at making games, but what I'm trying to do is create a learning plan, so the details don't matter one freakin bit to you. Point is, I'll get there, in my own time, and people saying 'You won't get your results in a reasonable time' is pointless. If you put yourself in my shoes, it seems you don't want anybody to even try, with the comments you put out.
3) All I'm asking about is how much harder is 2D vs 3D and a generalized question about engines, which nobody seems to want to answer. I've told you what my game is going to be, A SPACE RANGERS 2 clone of sorts, if you've never played the game, and you just want to assume I'm sitting here wide-eyed and wagging my tail hoping for a bone, you're horribly misguided. I've done other programming, I've gone to school for it, hell. So I know quite a bit about the process, and since I don't want to go to school to learn this, hell, I know I'll never get a job as a game programmer, so don't worry, but since I'm not going to school for it, I have to make my own learning plan.
4) Back to my earlier message, keep it to yourself, I won't be asking anything else.
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#24 Java Student  Icon User is online

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 07 February 2013 - 10:22 AM

View PostPwn, on 07 February 2013 - 07:18 AM, said:

What you don't understand is,
1) I'm not asking you to write any code, I haven't got that far yet, so it doesn't matter what I'm trying to code game-wise, as I haven't got that far yet, and,
2) I have no misconceptions of my abilities to create a game, I know I'm a noob at making games, but what I'm trying to do is create a learning plan, so the details don't matter one freakin bit to you. Point is, I'll get there, in my own time, and people saying 'You won't get your results in a reasonable time' is pointless. If you put yourself in my shoes, it seems you don't want anybody to even try, with the comments you put out.
3) All I'm asking about is how much harder is 2D vs 3D and a generalized question about engines, which nobody seems to want to answer. I've told you what my game is going to be, A SPACE RANGERS 2 clone of sorts, if you've never played the game, and you just want to assume I'm sitting here wide-eyed and wagging my tail hoping for a bone, you're horribly misguided. I've done other programming, I've gone to school for it, hell. So I know quite a bit about the process, and since I don't want to go to school to learn this, hell, I know I'll never get a job as a game programmer, so don't worry, but since I'm not going to school for it, I have to make my own learning plan.
4) Back to my earlier message, keep it to yourself, I won't be asking anything else.


You say "I'm not asking you to write any code, I haven't got that far yet" then after you say "I've done other programming, I've gone to school for it, hell.", so you went to school for programming but you can't code?

Anyways, if you put half the effort into learning to program as you do into your responses, you would already be learning about ObjectOrientedProgramming concepts by now. People saying 'You won't get your results in a reasonable time' is probably a reasonable statement considering you haven't written a line of code and your goal is to make a replica of a AAA-quality game.

View PostPwn, on 07 February 2013 - 07:18 AM, said:

4) Back to my earlier message, keep it to yourself, I won't be asking anything else.


Well, that's your prerogative, but we are just here to help. I suggest you spend some time programming by following some tutorials.
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#25 stayscrisp  Icon User is offline

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Re: 2D game vs 3D game

Posted 07 February 2013 - 10:27 AM

*Closing*

Nothing has been gained from this thread.
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