Immortality

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89 Replies - 3967 Views - Last Post: 03 August 2013 - 09:26 AM

#16 baavgai  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 10:09 AM

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View PostLemur, on 14 July 2013 - 10:43 PM, said:

If we find a way to improve humanity in any way, we should.


That's the rub, really. Who decides what's an improvement?

Even "improvements" done with the best of intentions will never be free of unintended consequences.

Who gets improved? Will have and have not divide ultimately result in Morlocks and Eloi and such?

And, of course, all is well until the EM pulse, computer virus, resulting insanity, etc.

Most humans don't know how to appreciate what they already have. Giving them the ability to choose their own "improvements" is like giving a three year old the ability choose dinner. How can candy for every meal be a bad thing?

I'm suddenly reminded of a quote...

Quote

Millions long for immortality who don't know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon.
-- Susan Ertz, Anger in the Sky

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#17 Raynes  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 07:36 PM

There is a fundamental problem with this topic, which is that it implies the existence of a God (and doesn't specify which God either, but I assume you mean the Christian God).

If the Christian God did exist, he knows precisely everything about us, what we're doing, what we have done, and what we will do until the end of the universe. It's hard to defy a being that designed our lives.
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#18 farrell2k  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 07:37 PM

View PostConciselyVerbose, on 15 July 2013 - 03:13 AM, said:

The alternative is voluntarily dying. Suicide is never an acceptable answer.


Oh? try having stage 4 Lukemia.
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#19 ConciselyVerbose  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 07:44 PM

View Postfarrell2k, on 15 July 2013 - 07:37 PM, said:

View PostConciselyVerbose, on 15 July 2013 - 03:13 AM, said:

The alternative is voluntarily dying. Suicide is never an acceptable answer.


Oh? try having stage 4 Lukemia.


I'm actually in favor of the right to die, so considering that I should have said something slightly different. But if you're not suffering from an incurable, terminal illness, there is no reason to voluntarily end your life in my mind (to save another may be acceptable depending on the circumstances, but beyond that, I don't see much).
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#20 jon.kiparsky  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 10:30 PM

View PostConciselyVerbose, on 15 July 2013 - 12:12 AM, said:

View PostFlukeshot, on 14 July 2013 - 09:56 PM, said:

I don't like to mix science and religion. "Because God" is not a valid reason to me. It would be nice to eradicate death but if we did, the world would very quickly run out of space. That said, I think humanity should take every possible step to improve itself - that's evolution.


How quickly? I don't think it's impossible to colonize the moon within 30 years or so, and, before we get to the point of running out of space, find other livable planets to start colonizing as well, especially with some of the added expertise of say 80+ years of experience and going strong, plus reasonable AI. The whole universe is ours to explore.



Think that one through for a minute. All of the colonizing we can do will never affect the population of the earth by one iota. Think of how much energy it takes to lift 200 pounds off the surface of the earth - then think about how many people there are, and how fast they reproduce. Colonization will be a seeding effort if it ever happens, not a migration. Humanity will smother itself on earth unless we deal with population, and that's not likely to happen. Spaceships will not be part of that solution - sorry.
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#21 ConciselyVerbose  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 10:33 PM

Clearly the technology doesn't exist yet. That doesn't mean that it won't.
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#22 jon.kiparsky  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 10:43 PM

I'm not talking about technology, I'm talking about thermodynamics. To move 200 pounds of human out of the earth's gravity well, a billion times, is beyond the energy budget of the earth. And since people keep reproducing, that wouldn't even buy you thirty years of leeway. Space doesn't solve population - if you think it does, you need to think about it a little.

Mankind might well make it to the stars, but the people on the earth are going to live and die on the earth.
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#23 vks.gautam1  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 15 July 2013 - 11:52 PM

It doesn't matter for the poor man in third world country where people are dying due to hunger , shortage of water , minor incurable diseases(curable in other countries). we all are talking about Immortality but we are still failed to provide basic things to every human being on this world .
http://www.bread.org/hunger/global/

This post has been edited by vks.gautam1: 15 July 2013 - 11:53 PM

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#24 dorknexus  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 16 July 2013 - 01:44 AM

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Suicide is never an acceptable answer.

wai come?
would you acknowledge my right to free speech?
would you acknowledge my right to listen to taylor swift?
would you acknowledge my right to jerk my meat to whatever imagery i might fancy (see above)?

why won't you acknowledge my right to extinguish myself?

it always seemed strange to me that the destruction of self was considered selfish.
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#25 h4nnib4l  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 16 July 2013 - 05:41 AM

The fact that Kurzweil has predicted events to line up favorably for his own immortality, coupled with his much-greater-than-average fear of death, puts his singularity propositions in question for me. Not to downplay his intelligence or success, but listening to him talk about it, it sounds more like a mental condition than an accurate hypothesis...
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#26 Michael26  Icon User is online

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Re: Immortality

Posted 16 July 2013 - 05:48 AM

View PostFlukeshot, on 15 July 2013 - 06:56 AM, said:

I don't like to mix science and religion.


If you don't like that, i suggest you not to read any book from warhammer franchise
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#27 supersloth  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 16 July 2013 - 09:02 AM

i look forward to being a cyborg when the singularity takes place, yes.
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#28 ishkabible  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 16 July 2013 - 10:13 AM

Quote

it always seemed strange to me that the destruction of self was considered selfish.


While I do believe i the right to off yourself I only think it is unselfish in certain cases. It's selfish because of what it does to others, not because of what it does to you. It's always your right but frequently it is selfish. An unselfish case would be a terminal illness or such. Now if no one but the people you pay bills to know you exist then I don't really see why it would be selfish.
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#29 h4nnib4l  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 16 July 2013 - 10:42 AM

Is it my fault if people place an expectation on me to only die if I don't want to?
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#30 ConciselyVerbose  Icon User is offline

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Re: Immortality

Posted 16 July 2013 - 10:49 AM

View Postdorknexus, on 16 July 2013 - 01:44 AM, said:

Quote

Suicide is never an acceptable answer.

wai come?
would you acknowledge my right to free speech?
would you acknowledge my right to listen to taylor swift?
would you acknowledge my right to jerk my meat to whatever imagery i might fancy (see above)?

why won't you acknowledge my right to extinguish myself?

it always seemed strange to me that the destruction of self was considered selfish.


It's selfish when other people are relying on you, but I wasn't intending to say it's not something you have a "right" to do, just that I think it is almost always the wrong choice. How bad does your life have to be (and be unfixable) that nothingness is better.
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