This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Need some direction

  • (3 Pages)
  • +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3

31 Replies - 4718 Views - Last Post: 01 July 2009 - 02:45 AM Rate Topic: -----

#1 Recoil  Icon User is offline

  • D.I.C Addict

Reputation: 51
  • View blog
  • Posts: 504
  • Joined: 28-June 08

This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Post icon  Posted 28 June 2008 - 06:04 AM

Long time viewer, first time poster...

I am making my own game (like you havn't heard that before). I have had so much problems with learning C++ it isn't funny, so I really began with VB.net which I started learning from the classes at school. I have found it easier to write my code in VB and I am able to understand it better when trying to convert it to C++.

So, I have my first spiffy game...started small and made my own slot machine game with 9 reels, lots of timers, and tons of code written for the prizes...fairly simple, just really long (and in VB.NET :P ) with ripped graphics and all, other than the interface which I designed. Had a problem with scrolling of the wheels and am dropping this right now. So I move on to making the game I always have, my 2D non-massive MORPG. Initially this is going to be a graphical chat window with collision detection. There are engines already made for something of this nature, but none are open sourced that I have found so I can understand the process better, and using something that is premade will help a lot, but take fun out of learning to do it myself.

I am not here to ask how to make a MMORPG...I am trying to understand how they work a bit better. I know this will take A LOT of time, but time is all I have...I know for a game like this I will want:

Database - to save character info
Server - that will send game info to client
Client - for people to see info coming from the server
Map Editor - for ummm, editing maps? :D

Not worried about where to host this thing right now as prices will change during the few years it will take for this process. But, what am I missing? I have read so many books on game programming, game design, etc...all are either just for beginners, or do not explain the specific components needed for an MORPG. I have yet to find anyone list the specific "parts" of the game engine I need to work on. And yes, I have search this and every other forum known to Google...this one is the only one I have found with tons of insightful people.

One other thing for some more advanced game designers...there is a term I am looking for to better research, but have yet to find it. It deals with mapping screens where you are able to make a "bridge" or other overhead area that can be travelled across 1 way, and travel underneath the other. I know it has something to do with the layering, but all of the map editors I have found do not deal with this process. I have found this in a translated version of Secret of Mana 3 where the mapping system allows for this, but am unable to get in contact with any of the programmers for this game. Pretty much I am just looking for the terminology.

If these questions have been asked before, please let me know and I will search the forum again.

Is This A Good Question/Topic? 0
  • +

Replies To: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

#2 stayscrisp  Icon User is offline

  • フカユ
  • member icon

Reputation: 1040
  • View blog
  • Posts: 4,325
  • Joined: 14-February 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 28 June 2008 - 07:42 AM

unfortunately nothings free, and i don't condone using torrents to get these books, try preowned :)
I own the latter one and its amazingly good, have no idea about the other one!

http://www.amazon.co...t/dp/1584502436

http://www.amazon.co...t/dp/0761532986
Was This Post Helpful? 1
  • +
  • -

#3 Recoil  Icon User is offline

  • D.I.C Addict

Reputation: 51
  • View blog
  • Posts: 504
  • Joined: 28-June 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 28 June 2008 - 07:52 AM

View Poststayscrisp, on 28 Jun, 2008 - 07:42 AM, said:

unfortunately nothings free, and i don't condone using torrents to get these books, try preowned :)
I own the latter one and its amazingly good, have no idea about the other one!

http://www.amazon.co...t/dp/1584502436

http://www.amazon.co...t/dp/0761532986



Thanks for the links. All my stuff is either legit stuff bought from a bookstore, borrowed from friends, stuff easily found for free on Google, or old school books (not really old). I don't use torrents cause a lot I have heard comes with virus's, and government is cracking down on people.

Looking at the second link in the description, "architecture of multiplayer games" I guess is what I need. If this is the one you own, on a scale of 1-10 how much has it helped you advance?
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#4 stayscrisp  Icon User is offline

  • フカユ
  • member icon

Reputation: 1040
  • View blog
  • Posts: 4,325
  • Joined: 14-February 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 28 June 2008 - 08:04 AM

Never really wanted to make a MORPG let alone MMORPG, sounds like a lot of work to me, but that book has a very good introduction to all things multiplayer, whereas the first book i think is assuming you already have an understanding of things such as multiplayer games and how they work.

id give it a 9 for how it helped me to make my first LAN type multiplayer game, its worth it :)
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#5 Tom9729  Icon User is offline

  • Segmentation fault
  • member icon

Reputation: 181
  • View blog
  • Posts: 2,642
  • Joined: 30-December 07

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 28 June 2008 - 05:23 PM

Write your own map format. Write your own map editor. :)

It sounds like what you want are multilevel maps (just made that term up, but it's applicable). That alone could be it's own thread.

If you want to write an MMORPG, get some experience writing networking code. That will be a BIG part of it. :^:
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#6 Recoil  Icon User is offline

  • D.I.C Addict

Reputation: 51
  • View blog
  • Posts: 504
  • Joined: 28-June 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 28 June 2008 - 06:08 PM

That does sound applicable. I have used several map editors and they consist of layering. I have thought about using scripts to move the character up or down a layer depending on the direction when going under something like a bridge or overhead area. I did plan on working on my own map editor just so I can tweak it to allow for certain options, but I was also thinking of it just being built in. I have also thought about a 2D game on a 3D engine...that has been done I am certain though. I also thought about using 3D models with a fixed 30deg viewing angle, but writing a 3D engine is way above my skill level.

I have put a lot of thought into this. I am not worried about making the next best 2D MMORPG, because the storyline can all be written in. I just want the experience of making my own engine where everything works together. While this does seem like a lot, I am starting small and going to be working on making stuff with C++ instead of translating it from VB.NET. So my first task is to make a multi user chat for like 3 people to start. Then just work my way up with a place to save all the information transferred, then make it graphical with a window and collision/movement sprites.

So far I have made the interface with VB.NET just to get a feel of what I want to end up with. When I get some stuff arranged on my drives and everything scanned, I will probably post some pictures later on tonight. Thanks for the replies :) .
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#7 Tom9729  Icon User is offline

  • Segmentation fault
  • member icon

Reputation: 181
  • View blog
  • Posts: 2,642
  • Joined: 30-December 07

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 28 June 2008 - 10:38 PM

Hypothetically speaking, if one was going to make an MMORPG, there are quite a few Open Source frameworks floating around on the interwebs. :) I posted a list of them somewhere, ahhh my poor memory.
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#8 Recoil  Icon User is offline

  • D.I.C Addict

Reputation: 51
  • View blog
  • Posts: 504
  • Joined: 28-June 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 29 June 2008 - 05:22 PM

Check the attachment for a screenshot. This is just a general layout. I made the button graphics, and the GUI. I did not make the actual game screen tiles...they are just compiled together from tiles found on the web with a map editor, then made into a picture. Each tab button opens individual inventory's sections depending what they are. I would post the .exe but it is like 1.67mb which would exceed the 1k upload space.

The chat section actually does scroll up when more text is input, but there is no networking with this yet because I am going to be re-writing the entire thing since I plan on changing languages. This was just easier for me to work with being I have a knowledge of VB.NET. I want to say I had a key that would bring up the map editor sections of this, but it has been like 3 months since I have worked on this and forget right now which it was and am too lazy to read the code :D .

If there was a way I would just do this in VB.NET, but I am not really sure it can support the functions that I am wanting in this engine. Comments welcome...

Check the attachment for a screenshot. This is just a general layout. I made the button graphics, and the GUI. I did not make the actual game screen tiles...they are just compiled together from tiles found on the web with a map editor, then made into a picture. Each tab button opens individual inventory's sections depending what they are. I would post the .exe but it is like 1.67mb which would exceed the 1k upload space.

The chat section actually does scroll up when more text is input, but there is no networking with this yet because I am going to be re-writing the entire thing since I plan on changing languages. This was just easier for me to work with being I have a knowledge of VB.NET. I want to say I had a key that would bring up the map editor sections of this, but it has been like 3 months since I have worked on this and forget right now which it was and am too lazy to read the code :D .

If there was a way I would just do this in VB.NET, but I am not really sure it can support the functions that I am wanting in this engine. Comments welcome...Attached Image
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#9 Tom9729  Icon User is offline

  • Segmentation fault
  • member icon

Reputation: 181
  • View blog
  • Posts: 2,642
  • Joined: 30-December 07

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 29 June 2008 - 06:27 PM

You could probably use VB.NET to do what you wanted. I've never programmed in it, but I'd imagine your main problems would come from lack of third party libraries/bindings, and limitations, of well, any BASIC derivative.

I recommend looking at this library.

Quote

Arianne is a multiplayer online games framework and engine to develop turn based and real time games.

It provides a simple way of creating games on a portable and robust server architecture. The server is coded in Java and uses Python for your game description, provides a MySQL backend and uses an TCP transport channel to communicate with dozens of players.

Our reference client engines are coded using Java and the C language in order to achieve maximum portability.


You'll still have to do quite a considerable amount of work, but it would definitely give you a head start. There are several tutorials I believe, as well as several reference games made using it. :^:

This post has been edited by Tom9729: 29 June 2008 - 06:28 PM

Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#10 Recoil  Icon User is offline

  • D.I.C Addict

Reputation: 51
  • View blog
  • Posts: 504
  • Joined: 28-June 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 29 June 2008 - 07:24 PM

Arianne requires several things to run, mySQL being one of them. I have used mySQL once with running a game and it consisted of simply starting it and stopping it. I don't know anything else about it really, or what it does :blink: . There are several things to learn when using this engine such as Java, and python scripting if I am reading it correctly. Needing to download and learn several things just to get something running seems a bit overwhelming and it kinda takes away from me learning the complete inner-workings of an engine.

Being that my graphical chat thingy is going to be small, I am still probably going to go with C++ and perhaps DirectX because I have a couple of books borrowed on these, and the support I am able to find on the net for both is vast...not so much with DirectX in VB.NET. I have found several source codes for MORPG's written in VB6, but not having VB6 myself makes it difficult to understand what the game is doing since the upgrade wizard in .NET f#&@'s up the code conversion. I have searched for bootleg versions just for being able to view code...yet to find it :crazy: .

Thanks for the link though. This gives me some better idea of the kind of architecture I will need to implement in my engine.
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#11 Tom9729  Icon User is offline

  • Segmentation fault
  • member icon

Reputation: 181
  • View blog
  • Posts: 2,642
  • Joined: 30-December 07

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 29 June 2008 - 08:03 PM

MySQL is a database server. It's a pretty widely used system. :^:

From what I understand you can write games using Arianne in C, C++, Python. The server is programmed using Python scripts.

Once you learn one language well enough to do something like that, you won't have much trouble jumping to other languages. I know what you mean though, I prefer writing things myself the first time just to get an understanding of them. :)

I don't mean any offense when I say this, but I think you'll have enough on your plate just learning how to use a 3d API like DirectX or OpenGL (I recommend OpenGL over DirectX, DirectX only runs on Windows). You should concentrate on writing some kind of simple 3d game first.
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#12 Recoil  Icon User is offline

  • D.I.C Addict

Reputation: 51
  • View blog
  • Posts: 504
  • Joined: 28-June 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 21 July 2008 - 03:20 PM

On post#8 of this thread...my screenshot of the GUI...

This mainly has more to do with VB.NET programming question rather than a general game programming question, but I did not want to start a new thread in VB.NET section that is dealing with the same program.

So, I have sketched out more on my layout, how everything is supposed to communicate (I think), and have started working on making sprites move with bitblt on a separate project...just wanting to get something working for now.

Now I am moving on to loading maps, or atleast bitmaps for a background right now. The problem I am running into deals with the PictureBox1 that I am using to show the background picture.

With the sprite moving project, I can load the sprite to move around on a solid background, and erase the sprite when it moves and replace the color with the same color of the background. This project is an entire window where the sprite has no bounds other than the window edges.

Now I have been searching on how to draw the sprite on a separate layer so that I still have my background intact when the sprite moves. Also, I have looked as to how I would code this so the PictureBox1 is the area where the background will load and the sprite will walk without erasing parts of the background or the rest of my GUI.

I think I am looking too hard into this problem, but I am not sure how to simplify this. Perhaps there is a more efficient way of doing this that I am looking over? My brain is so fried over this that I am not sure I am even explaining the problem correctly :/
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#13 Tom9729  Icon User is offline

  • Segmentation fault
  • member icon

Reputation: 181
  • View blog
  • Posts: 2,642
  • Joined: 30-December 07

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 21 July 2008 - 08:34 PM

You have to redraw the scene every time you update it.

Edit: The whole scene.

Forgive me if I missed the point. I've never programmed in VB. :)

This post has been edited by Tom9729: 21 July 2008 - 08:34 PM

Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#14 Recoil  Icon User is offline

  • D.I.C Addict

Reputation: 51
  • View blog
  • Posts: 504
  • Joined: 28-June 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 21 July 2008 - 09:25 PM

View PostTom9729, on 21 Jul, 2008 - 08:34 PM, said:

You have to redraw the scene every time you update it.

Edit: The whole scene.

Forgive me if I missed the point. I've never programmed in VB. :)


For some reason I was thinking that if there were layers, I would just need to update the sprite layer for changes in position...well crap...back to the drawing board. I was really hoping to get a mock up of the basics before transferring this to another language, but it looks like I am going to have to start from scratch right from the beginning because of how VB.NET handles graphics. I still am probably going to try and get the chat working atleast.
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

#15 stayscrisp  Icon User is offline

  • フカユ
  • member icon

Reputation: 1040
  • View blog
  • Posts: 4,325
  • Joined: 14-February 08

Re: This is not a "Help me make a MMORPG" post...

Posted 21 July 2008 - 09:32 PM

View PostTom9729, on 21 Jul, 2008 - 08:34 PM, said:

I've never programmed in VB. :)


good for you sir :)
Was This Post Helpful? 0
  • +
  • -

  • (3 Pages)
  • +
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3