Where to start, with making games...

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#1 StapledPuppet  Icon User is offline

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Where to start, with making games...

Posted 17 January 2009 - 02:39 PM

I know this is probably asked all the time around these kinda places, but where should someone like me start if I want to make games, no matter what type (at the moment). I know the tiniest bits of C++, lots of HTML... And I just really want to make games.

So, I was wondering, rather than just pointing me in the right direction, if some of you could actually guide me a bit. If not - oh well - this was worth a try :^:

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#2 Martyr2  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 17 January 2009 - 04:46 PM

First thing I would do is conduct a search with the keywords "Game programming" and you are going to get some of the biggest boards and such for game programming topics ever.

Second thing I would do is go to your local bookstore and find the game programming book section (in the computer book section) and open a few up and take a look.

Third thing I would do after I have found some places to ask questions and got my book in hand is try out a very small game that you could probably code up in less than an hour. Then see if you can add some new feature onto it little by little.

Other things you can look for, if you are not into a huge amount of programming, is software like Realm Crafter, Game Maker 7 and other similar tools that make games easy. You could also try out a little bit of your scripting prowess on something like Second Life.

It is up to you, but first gather up all the resources you can and then pick through it to see what you might be interested in making and the technologies you might want to use. Go with whatever you find easiest for you to learn and then build a small small project.

:)
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#3 StapledPuppet  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 17 January 2009 - 05:33 PM

Hmm... Well these are all things I have tried in the past :) I have made a full game with Game Maker & before, and I thought it turned out quite well. Anyway, what I don't see how to do is, with one of your suggestion - also mentioned by many online tutorials - is to add new features. See, if I am a total beginner, I wouldn't know where to start :D And I can get pretty much any book I want because my parents own a book shop. Also, to No. 3 - What would you call a small game? Pong, Tetris? Anything? And with C++, all I can ever learn in like everything about algorithms, function, variables and all sorts. I can never see how any of it could relate to games. I am sure it does... eventually... But should I start with C++ Game programming for beginners or C++ programming for beginners?

Sorry if this reply is a bit loaded and unstructured. Just this site has brought many questions to mind :)

Thanks anyway, so far your help has been good. Oh and thanks in advance...
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#4 Kirth  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 18 January 2009 - 02:01 AM

View PostStapledPuppet, on 17 Jan, 2009 - 04:33 PM, said:

But should I start with C++ Game programming for beginners or C++ programming for beginners?


I believe game programming requires you to master the language you're using already. And in case of C++ that might be one tough chunk.

You could try C# (<3) and XNA game studios?
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#5 StapledPuppet  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 18 January 2009 - 03:14 AM

Hmm... Good idea... But I don't understand the concept of C# and XNA working together? How do they work?
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#6 MorphiusFaydal  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 18 January 2009 - 06:12 AM

XNA is essentially a DirectX wrapper for C# that adds some useful stuff for building games with.

If you want to order a book on it: "Professional XNA Programming - Building Games for Xbox 360 and Windows with XNA 2.0, 2nd Edition". By Benjamin Nitschke. Wrox Press.

The other book you can buy is "Beginning XNA 2.0 Game Programming - From Novice to Professional" by Alexandre Lob„o, Bruno Evangelista, and Josť Antonio Leal de Farias. Apress.

I would recommend both.

This post has been edited by MorphiusFaydal: 18 January 2009 - 06:12 AM

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#7 StapledPuppet  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 18 January 2009 - 10:26 AM

Well, seen as I am beginner... Should I try with the latter? If I choose C#...
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I just went into town - and found I few C++ books. I am still on the ground level of which language to choose, and I am starting to get into a rather annoyed state. I just really want to start learning a language (then hopefully, once I have learnt one, learn others aswell (that's how it works right)). So I just want to knuckle down with a language, learn it over a few months (or years :S) and try a first few mini games.

Furthermore, with the 'learn C++ in 21 days' kinda books, they are not related to games... So I don't know whether to learn C++ in general - and then apply to games?

I all of my questions can be answered. Thanks in advance to anyone who helps me out further :)
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#8 UG Cyber  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 18 January 2009 - 08:50 PM

I started learning C++ just under a year ago. So i am FAR from mastering it, but i got into openGL about a month or two ago and i am already making my first map. GLUT helps out alot and there are TONS of tuts out there for it.

OpenGL is complicated, but once you got the window set up, it's only a matter of X, Y, Z coords and some logic.

The real question that you should be asking your self is what type of game do you want to make? FPS, Third person shooter, RPG...etc. Different languages work best for different types. If you already know a lot of HTML, then i would look into Javascript and make some games from that.

[edit] Learning C++ in 21 days will teach you a lot that you will use in games, such as OOP, file streaming, structs, classes, arrays, vars. That is what i learned from. then i searched the internet for other functions that i needed for the projects

This post has been edited by UG Cyber: 18 January 2009 - 08:53 PM

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#9 Core  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 18 January 2009 - 09:58 PM

View PostMorphiusFaydal, on 18 Jan, 2009 - 05:12 AM, said:

XNA is essentially a DirectX wrapper for C# that adds some useful stuff for building games with.

If you want to order a book on it: "Professional XNA Programming - Building Games for Xbox 360 and Windows with XNA 2.0, 2nd Edition". By Benjamin Nitschke. Wrox Press.

The other book you can buy is "Beginning XNA 2.0 Game Programming - From Novice to Professional" by Alexandre Lob„o, Bruno Evangelista, and Josť Antonio Leal de Farias. Apress.

I would recommend both.


Just to mention (to avoid later disappointment) that using XNA you cannot create commercial games for the Xbox 360 platform. Also, to run, deploy and debug your games on the Xbox 360 console you will have to purchase a XNA Creators Premium membership (or if you qualify, obtain a free 12-month trial from DreamSpark).
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#10 Hyper  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 19 January 2009 - 02:58 AM

View PostCore, on 18 Jan, 2009 - 08:58 PM, said:

View PostMorphiusFaydal, on 18 Jan, 2009 - 05:12 AM, said:

XNA is essentially a DirectX wrapper for C# that adds some useful stuff for building games with.

If you want to order a book on it: "Professional XNA Programming - Building Games for Xbox 360 and Windows with XNA 2.0, 2nd Edition". By Benjamin Nitschke. Wrox Press.

The other book you can buy is "Beginning XNA 2.0 Game Programming - From Novice to Professional" by Alexandre Lob„o, Bruno Evangelista, and Josť Antonio Leal de Farias. Apress.

I would recommend both.


Just to mention (to avoid later disappointment) that using XNA you cannot create commercial games for the Xbox 360 platform. Also, to run, deploy and debug your games on the Xbox 360 console you will have to purchase a XNA Creators Premium membership (or if you qualify, obtain a free 12-month trial from DreamSpark).


X-Box works fine as well. Modded X-Box (hard-mod or soft-mod) works great. It's free.
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#11 StapledPuppet  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 19 January 2009 - 12:03 PM

@UG Cyber - wow, this helped alot. So all the basics and further C++ will eventually amount to being able to learn games (so I learn C++, then learn how to apply to games?).

Also, I don't really understand anything about how DX9 and OpenGL and all these things relate to anything? Thanks in advance to any firther replies :D

@Core & Hyper: I don't really mind whether I can reach Xbox360 or not... I just really, really want to get stuck in learning... But I can only do that once I know where to start - and that start point needs to be just right :)

This post has been edited by StapledPuppet: 19 January 2009 - 12:05 PM

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#12 UG Cyber  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 19 January 2009 - 05:48 PM

View PostStapledPuppet, on 19 Jan, 2009 - 11:03 AM, said:

@UG Cyber - wow, this helped alot. So all the basics and further C++ will eventually amount to being able to learn games (so I learn C++, then learn how to apply to games?).

Also, I don't really understand anything about how DX9 and OpenGL and all these things relate to anything? Thanks in advance to any firther replies :D

@Core & Hyper: I don't really mind whether I can reach Xbox360 or not... I just really, really want to get stuck in learning... But I can only do that once I know where to start - and that start point needs to be just right :)

OpenGL with GLUT (OpenGL tool kit) is what i use for my 3d programming. It has many features and is flexible. I'm not sure if it (GLUT) Supports linux, but i know that openGL does.

Now, just as an insite, You have to specify alot with openGL. Say i drew a Cube on the screen, you have to create your own camera functions, then tell the camera that it cant "walk" through it by comparing the X, Y, and Z coordinates and what to do if your camera collides with the cube. If you want to have graphics other then solid colors in your map, you have to make / find a bitmap. make it a certain size, load it, make a function return the handle, then map the BMP according to your coords. It seems / sounds hard but it's not. It's is just time consuming and a lot of code.

But yes, i would start with that book, learn some basic Windows API for keyboard strokes (simple) then take it from there. It will also give you a confident feel for C++ and it's Syntax.
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#13 Tom9729  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 19 January 2009 - 05:58 PM

View PostUG Cyber, on 19 Jan, 2009 - 07:48 PM, said:

OpenGL with GLUT (OpenGL tool kit) is what i use for my 3d programming. It has many features and is flexible. I'm not sure if it (GLUT) Supports linux, but i know that openGL does.

Now, just as an insite, You have to specify alot with openGL. Say i drew a Cube on the screen, you have to create your own camera functions, then tell the camera that it cant "walk" through it by comparing the X, Y, and Z coordinates and what to do if your camera collides with the cube. If you want to have graphics other then solid colors in your map, you have to make / find a bitmap. make it a certain size, load it, make a function return the handle, then map the BMP according to your coords. It seems / sounds hard but it's not. It's is just time consuming and a lot of code.

But yes, i would start with that book, learn some basic Windows API for keyboard strokes (simple) then take it from there. It will also give you a confident feel for C++ and it's Syntax.

The whole point of GLUT is that it is cross-platform, and that it handles things like window management and keyboard/mouse input that you would normally need to use system-specific APIs for. :)

Edit: Oops, forgot to mention the whole reason I made this post. GLUT has implementations on a lot of systems including Linux.

This post has been edited by Tom9729: 19 January 2009 - 06:00 PM

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#14 Core  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 19 January 2009 - 06:13 PM

View PostHyper, on 19 Jan, 2009 - 01:58 AM, said:

View PostCore, on 18 Jan, 2009 - 08:58 PM, said:

View PostMorphiusFaydal, on 18 Jan, 2009 - 05:12 AM, said:

XNA is essentially a DirectX wrapper for C# that adds some useful stuff for building games with.

If you want to order a book on it: "Professional XNA Programming - Building Games for Xbox 360 and Windows with XNA 2.0, 2nd Edition". By Benjamin Nitschke. Wrox Press.

The other book you can buy is "Beginning XNA 2.0 Game Programming - From Novice to Professional" by Alexandre Lob„o, Bruno Evangelista, and Josť Antonio Leal de Farias. Apress.

I would recommend both.


Just to mention (to avoid later disappointment) that using XNA you cannot create commercial games for the Xbox 360 platform. Also, to run, deploy and debug your games on the Xbox 360 console you will have to purchase a XNA Creators Premium membership (or if you qualify, obtain a free 12-month trial from DreamSpark).


X-Box works fine as well. Modded X-Box (hard-mod or soft-mod) works great. It's free.


I've never seen people using XNA to develop original Xbox games (which, I think is already outdated). XNA is designed to develop games only for the Xbox 360 platform. Modifying the console isn't a good thing, first of all because it voids the warranty and in most of the cases the modified console is used for incorrect purposes. I really wouldn't recommend modifying the console.
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#15 WolfCoder  Icon User is offline

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Re: Where to start, with making games...

Posted 20 January 2009 - 07:10 AM

I loathe C# simply because it's not easily platform independent, it's Microsoft, and it's awkward. I think JAVA is an easier language to program in simply because it already has all the basic algorithms for everything including a kitchen sink in the API and works on all platforms while C++ can give you incredible speed while being object oriented.

I can see how a beginner would choose C# but I think it's best if you're going to move from game editors to programming yourself that you go to C++, it's how I did it.

As a side note, OpenGL is a specification, and there's most likely an implementation for JAVA out there already.

This post has been edited by WolfCoder: 20 January 2009 - 07:11 AM

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