[TheMightyUch]

modi123_1, on 21 October 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

Let's be clear here - schizophrenic and pedophilia are different things. It is not 'funny' how murder and pedophilia are treated different. It is not equivalent to compare a schizophrenic committing murder to a pedophile.

I see them both as a form of mental illness. My opinion differs from yours. sorry />

modi123_1, on 21 October 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

I would disagree. I do not think that would be the situation. At best the police may be called.

That depends on where you live. Where I've grown up, it would probably happen.

modi123_1, on 21 October 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

Now I am confused. Is this tabula rasa philosophy extending to the mentally ill, or just those that are stuck in, and perpetuating, the cycle of sexual violence?

People are not born with the common cold, neither are all of them born with a mental illness. A traumatic event like molestation is a common cause of mental instability that leads to pedophilia.

[TheMightyUch]

depricated, on 21 October 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

I'm sick of people pretending that there's a normal.

True, there is no true normal. Some c̶u̶l̶t̶u̶r̶a̶l̶ cultures embrace child brides and all of that. However, I would accept if someone where to say there is a normal within a certain culture because in a way, there is.

This post has been edited by TheMightyUch: 21 October 2014 - 09:21 AM

[BenignDesign]

depricated, on 21 October 2014 - 12:09 PM, said:

You can't label everything a mental illness simply because it deviates from the way you think. So you don't get your rocks off to little kids, but Jim over there does. I'm probably into shit you're not - knives and hot wax, for instance, doesn't do it for most people. Am I mentally ill because it does for me?

There's a big difference between consenting adults using knives and hot wax to get their rocks off (some of us would prefer leather wrist straps to knives) and an adult molesting a child to get their rocks off.

I agree that Jim's kiddie manga shouldn't result in jail time, but if old Jimbo puts his wiener in a little kid, Jimbo has some jailable issues going on.

And yes, you are mentally ill. For no reason other than I said so.

[modi123_1]

@uch

What factors are there that you would make schizophrenia and pedophilia equivalent? In what framework would you smirk and say it is funny that there are different circumstances for criminal punishment with the two?

Woah.. so your theory that mental illness is like a common cold does not allow for a world where causes of mental illness contain genetics or chemical imbalances? Awesome sauce. Predisposition, family history, eating lead paint chips, etc are never a factor? Snazzy.

[TheMightyUch]

modi123_1, on 21 October 2014 - 04:21 PM, said:

@uch

What factors are there that you would make schizophrenia and pedophilia equivalent? In what framework would you smirk and say it is funny that there are different circumstances for criminal punishment with the two?

Woah.. so your theory that mental illness is like a common cold does not allow for a world where causes of mental illness contain genetics or chemical imbalances? Awesome sauce. Predisposition, family history, eating lead paint chips, etc are never a factor? Snazzy.

I am obviously not laughing at the subject. I was being sarcastic.

I clearly stated that not all of them are born with mental illnesses.

This post has been edited by TheMightyUch: 21 October 2014 - 09:27 AM

[modi123_1]

It's hard to tell when mental illness is like the common cold.

[depricated]

modi123_1, on 21 October 2014 - 09:59 AM, said:

Quote

Society approaches this subject with too much hostility. If i were to be standing on the street corner and someone pointed to me and shouted "THAT MAN MOLESTED MY SON/DAUGHTER" I would probably be approached by some bystanders and find myself in an extremely harmful situation.

I would disagree. I do not think that would be the situation. At best the police may be called.

Eh, there's something to this. I think it's true that society approaches the topic with too much hostility - at least in the US it's standard that men among children are pretty much anathema.

Here's an experience I recounted recently. Just one of many. If you'd like more, I'll be happy to continue.

I dated a woman for 4 years, who has 2 daughters. Not mine. They were 3 and 5 when we started dating. I took the younger one to Meijer with me while I was grocery shopping. The older was with her mother iirc. So there we are, walking through the store, and I take her over to the toy aisle, because I've got a few extra bucks and I'm totally gonna try and bribe her to like me. It's worth noting that she was a little drama queen, and we usually found it quite funny. In this case, she wanted a lego set more expensive than I could afford. So I told her to pick something else, and showed her some alternatives in my budget. She throws herself down and starts screaming and crying. Well, I'm not going to reward that, so I bargain with her - "you won't get anything if you're on the floor!" Still nothin. So finally I decide screw it, tell her to get up and we're leaving. After a few minutes I just pick her up and walk out of the store. Where I'm greeted by police, who had been called because I was lurking over a crying child. I try to explain, no I'm her mom's boyfriend, we were grocery shopping, etc. No, I'm cuffed and thrown into the back of a cop car. They call her mom, make her leave whatever she was doing, (I honestly don't remember) with the older kid, and come pick up her daughter. Now I had the only car between the two of us, which meant she had to find a ride. Then go and get photo ID and shit to prove that she's the kid's mother since they got her name and number from me. They finally sort out that no, I'm not some pedophile kidnapper, I was just trying to be a responsible step-parent and not reward bad behavior, and let me go. No apology, nothing. 4 hours of my life pissed away, humiliated in front of everyone who came and went, because I both have a penis and the capacity to care for a child.

So yes, society makes way too many assumptions. Women are just as capable of many, many evil acts, including pedophelia, as men are. But there's a stigma against men in a father role, and that's bullshit. What if she'd been my daughter and I just didn't have a fucking picture of her in my wallet? Would they have even trusted that? They didn't trust me enough to trust her fucking mother!

Fuck that pisses me off so much just remembering it.

[TheMightyUch]

modi123_1, on 21 October 2014 - 04:26 PM, said:

It's hard to tell when mental illness is like the common cold.

It helps to read things slower. I did not say that.

[depricated]

BenignDesign, on 21 October 2014 - 10:18 AM, said:

depricated, on 21 October 2014 - 12:09 PM, said:

You can't label everything a mental illness simply because it deviates from the way you think. So you don't get your rocks off to little kids, but Jim over there does. I'm probably into shit you're not - knives and hot wax, for instance, doesn't do it for most people. Am I mentally ill because it does for me?

There's a big difference between consenting adults using knives and hot wax to get their rocks off (some of us would prefer leather wrist straps to knives) and an adult molesting a child to get their rocks off.

I agree that Jim's kiddie manga shouldn't result in jail time, but if old Jimbo puts his wiener in a little kid, Jimbo has some jailable issues going on.

And yes, you are mentally ill. For no reason other than I said so.

Yes obviously there's a difference. Mainly that one is legal with consent and one still isn't.

Your mom is mentally ill.

Also: consider the Age of Majority is different in different areas, and wasn't 18 until absurdly recently.

[modi123_1]

Quote

So yes, society makes way too many assumptions. Women are just as capable of many, many evil acts, including pedophelia, as men are. But there's a stigma against men in a father role, and that's bullshit.

Sure.. sure.. look at the string of publicized teachers making the beast with two backs with underage students. Everyone's comments are "man, where was that teacher when I was in school" or pull a Southpark "Niiiice". Be it a guy and all hell breaks loose. A non balanced equation exists in family court as well.

[depricated]

Yes.

Now I don't think it's wrong to go after anyone proven to be builty with extreme prejudice. It's just worth noting that it's not all sunshine and rainbows.

[TheMightyUch]

modi123_1, on 21 October 2014 - 04:32 PM, said:

Quote

So yes, society makes way too many assumptions. Women are just as capable of many, many evil acts, including pedophelia, as men are. But there's a stigma against men in a father role, and that's bullshit.

Sure.. sure.. look at the string of publicized teachers making the beast with two backs with underage students. Everyone's comments are "man, where was that teacher when I was in school" or pull a Southpark "Niiiice". Be it a guy and all hell breaks loose. A non balanced equation exists in family court as well.

Couldn't agree any more.

[BenignDesign]

depricated, on 21 October 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

Your mom is mentally ill.

You have no.fucking.idea. That woman is messed.up.

depricated, on 21 October 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

Also: consider the Age of Majority is different in different areas, and wasn't 18 until absurdly recently.

There is a definite gray area in the age of consent arena. My personal thoughts:

Below the age of 13 is a complete and total absolute "no" under any and all circumstances. Fuck your culture's tradition of child brides. If you can't get a woman your own age to fuck you, maybe consider genital mutilation as an alternative to child rape.

At 13-15, speaking from the female side of things, they're starting to figure it out, but consent is very iffy in this range - does the kid actually, fully understand what she's consenting to? Or is she consenting to a vague idea?

A 16 or 17-year-old is completely capable of consenting despite the fact that they probably shouldn't.

A couple years ago, in one of the local high schools, a group of 4 girls (ages 16-17) made a pact with each other to see how many teachers they could get fired that year. They picked the youngest males on staff and mercilessly teased, taunted, and pursued until these men finally caved and had sex with them. All told, 8 teachers were removed and charged. Two of them committed suicide before their cases went to trial. The girls received no reprimand. They were made out to be the innocent victims of vicious sexual predators. It was sick, twisted, and wrong. These men have had their lives ruined forever by girls who knew EXACTLY what they were doing.

[depricated]

My point on the age of majority is only that 13-15 has very commonly been the age of majority throughout history. It's only very recently that this has been increased to 18, and that's still only held to by only most "civilized" countries. Shit, Alexander the Great won his first battle at 18. Some of us are still in high school at 18. In ancient Japan, boys would go through their genpuku as early as the age of 11, marking them as adults. It's a very modern, and relatively arbitrary, perspective which biology has no concern for. Nature impacts development as well, no matter how much people want to argue for the importance of nurtured behavior.

[BenignDesign]

What I'm getting from this is that you're arguing that a 30-year-old man and an 11-year-old girl (or vice versa) should be considered consensual sex. WTF?

Vaccinations are a modern thing, too, designed to improve the quality of life. Let's go back to the good old days of fucking children and dying of polio.