[spearfish]

Alright, right now I'm running a windows 98 machine, so I can't do much of anything through it anyways.

So where do I download this from?

[Nykc]

www.ubuntu.com

if you are on dial up you will be better off ordering the Live CD.
however Barnes and Nobel had an issue of Linux Magazine? (one of them) and it came with Ubuntu CD.

If you are unsure do not just install, check it out first. and definetly do a dual boot. My old laptop about 8 years old, I just went ahead and put Linux on it all-together.

[MorphiusFaydal]

If you have a decently high enough spec machine, you can try out Linux in VMWare.

[no2pencil]

Nykc, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 10:24 AM, said:

1. Easy as Click, Click, answer questions, click.

ROFL yeah, if you don't want to learn anything about what you are doing.... This is such a Microsoft style of installation. Doing installs like this is how you end up with Linux users rebooting trying to solve issues LOL! Don't confuse the poor kid. There are plenty of ways to install Linux, everything from click click click to downloading source code & manually running the software installation.

Nykc, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 10:24 AM, said:

5. Ubuntu would be best for you if you are just learning. There is good support on the Ubuntu forums as well.

While there is great support for Ubuntu, I still disagree that the Ubuntu distrobution is the best to learn with. If you want to learn what Linux is, then you should use one with a little more learning edge, I suggest trying Debian or Slackware.. If you want something that just works, then yeah, Ubuntu or Fedora is great.

If someone just blindly *throws* an Ubuntu install on their pc, & then they are looking at an Xwindows interface thinking, great, now what can it do? Oh? It can't run all of the programs that I want. Then they can walk away with their 1st impression that Linux sucks. It is my opinion that if a newbie goes through the pain of doing a REAL install, they get a better idea of what Linux is, & what it does, as well as if it's really best for them.

[spearfish]

So Pencil (or anybody), what would your best advice be for me to learn Linux? I was thinking, from the impression I was getting, that it was just like Windows except less stuff runs on it.

[no2pencil]

spearfish, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 01:14 PM, said:

I was thinking, from the impression I was getting, that it was just like Windows except less stuff runs on it.

You have to look at the larger picture.

The operating system is what allows software to execute, & interact with the hardware. Windows does this, as does Linux, Unix, MacOS, & everything else inbetween.

Microsoft Windows is a graphical interface integrated with the Operating System. Linux offers the ability to launch a graphical interface. There is a difference. On Linux you have multiple choices of Windows Mangers to choose from, allowing you to change the way that the desktop looks. None of this has anything to do with the operating system. There are also different filesystems that you can run, ext2, ext3, file systems that offer journaling, as well as the ones that Microsoft uses (fat16, fat32, NTFS). This doesn't allow you to execute programs however, this is just storage. The operating system must load the executable code into system memory 1st.

This is all just information, but it might help you to better understand what an OS is, before you dive into all of this head 1st.

My 1st experience with Linux was running Slackware. I had to learn all I could about my existing hardware, in order to boot the correct loader to perform an installation. Once I had the base OS on my system, I could load Xwindows & the window manager of my choice, & then use a web browser to get onto the net. Then download more software... ect. This is how I got a better understanding of what Linux is, & I liked it, so I kept with it. I think if I Ubuntu was around when I got into Linux, I would not have kept with it. However, some people prefer using something a little more simple, out of the box - turn key, so to speak. This method saves a lot more time, & you are up & running by lunch time, rather than by the end of the month! No one can really tell you which method is better for you, because everyone has their own opinion, & everyone works independently. Some people don't have the time to fuss with details, while others want to learn more about what's going on at lower levels.

If you want to get a taste of Linux, & how it works, then try Ubuntu. If you want to learn about Linux & how it works with your PC, then I suggest trying Slackware or Debian.

[spearfish]

The part I don't think I'm getting is what makes Linux different (or better, in some opinions) than Windows --- other than the file system, and that I'll have problems with it for a month.

What makes Linux special?

[no2pencil]

Well, for one thing it's built by the public. And since the source code for it is open source you can learn from it, as well as poke at it with a stick (so to speak). Nothing is kept secret, everything is there for you to look at or learn from.

There are free updates available from kernel.org, so you can update it & keep it secure. As compared to Microsoft Windows, they release an update once something is deemed "worth" fixing. With Linux YOU decide what gets put into your Operating System, & what it does, what it's doing. With Windows, you can patch things... if you know how. Or you have to wait for (or find) programs written by people who reverse engineered Windows, & created a work around.

Other than that... personal preference.

[spearfish]

So it's for people trying to learn, and better, their OS?

Mainly, I plan on sticking with PHP, although it would be interesting to look at how it works.

So, would I be able to make the transition to Ubuntu easily? What problems might I run into?

[MorphiusFaydal]

It depends on what you're doing. If you just need need something to edit PHP code on, surf the Internet, check your email, and watch the occasional DVD... Very few, if any, problems.

EDIT:
To add my philosophical two cents: For me, Linux is about choice. I run Gentoo, which is arguably one of the more "difficult" distributions of Linux to run. I have almost unparalleled control over what is on my system. Absolutely everything is built and configured to my specifications. I'm not interested in learning how to build an entire OS, or even just a kernel, from the ground up. (Well... I *would* like to hack together a simple kernel one day... ). I use Linux because I can, and because I want to. I like knowing that it's *my* operating system, not some half-assed piece of software that some moron in Redmond or Cupertino thinks I should want. (Although actually, I do like Mac OS X).

This post has been edited by MorphiusFaydal: 12 March 2008 - 01:55 PM

[spearfish]

So customization is one of the things that sets Linux apart - just like it's doing for Firefox?

[spearfish]

Also --- if I were to download ubuntu, I would be able to revert back to win98 fairly easily, right? I do have my Windows installation disk.

[MorphiusFaydal]

spearfish, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 05:30 PM, said:

Also --- if I were to download ubuntu, I would be able to revert back to win98 fairly easily, right? I do have my Windows installation disk.

Yeah. Just reinstall Windows.

spearfish, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 05:10 PM, said:

So customization is one of the things that sets Linux apart - just like it's doing for Firefox?

It's one of many reasons.

[spearfish]

Sounds good. I'll probably get set on ubuntu sometime soon --- it seems to be better for jumping in from what I can tell.

[Nykc]

no2pencil, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 04:06 PM, said:

Nykc, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 10:24 AM, said:

1. Easy as Click, Click, answer questions, click.

ROFL yeah, if you don't want to learn anything about what you are doing.... This is such a Microsoft style of installation. Doing installs like this is how you end up with Linux users rebooting trying to solve issues LOL! Don't confuse the poor kid. There are plenty of ways to install Linux, everything from click click click to downloading source code & manually running the software installation.

Nykc, on 12 Mar, 2008 - 10:24 AM, said:

5. Ubuntu would be best for you if you are just learning. There is good support on the Ubuntu forums as well.

While there is great support for Ubuntu, I still disagree that the Ubuntu distrobution is the best to learn with. If you want to learn what Linux is, then you should use one with a little more learning edge, I suggest trying Debian or Slackware.. If you want something that just works, then yeah, Ubuntu or Fedora is great.

If someone just blindly *throws* an Ubuntu install on their pc, & then they are looking at an Xwindows interface thinking, great, now what can it do? Oh? It can't run all of the programs that I want. Then they can walk away with their 1st impression that Linux sucks. It is my opinion that if a newbie goes through the pain of doing a REAL install, they get a better idea of what Linux is, & what it does, as well as if it's really best for them.

You are talking to a person who still has Windows 98 on his machine. I mean - the dude needs direction, he will look a slack and never come into the light.

READ THE DOCUMENTATION: LOL - Work your way through different distros and find one you are happy with.

They are all right, hell no2pencil is the one who convinced me to go Linux. I went with Ubuntu because I want to learn Linux, but am so overwhelmed with projects I needed the Distro with the least amount of hassle. I tried Fedora 8 didn't care for it, tried Ubuntu and liked it. I listen to three Linux podcasts and they all say great things about Ubuntu. Some of them run Gentoo and Open Suse, and even Slackware. It is personal preference, but if you want a easy transition go Ubuntu.

Just my 0.02 cents.

Morphius Faydal hit it on the nose - Complete control!!!! That's what makes Linux so great. "By the people, for the people.

The only problem I encountered on my old Laptop was with my wireless network card. I needed to do some tweaking to get it working. My new Laptop, I just installed and everything works like a charm.

This post has been edited by Nykc: 12 March 2008 - 05:06 PM